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Messages - Juraj Talcik

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1
Hardware / Re: Threadripper Builds
« on: 2019-06-13, 19:58:11 »
So does anyone remember how two years ago Intel sold quad-core HEDT cpus for x299 platform ? The infamous KabyLake-"X"  i7-7740X for 400 Euros ?

The one that was just 30perc. faster at stock than 6 years old (back then, 8 years now) Sandy Bridge i7 2700k, but overclocked worse, so it was almost tie. Who would guess what would come.

2
General Discussion / Re: Some thoughts on Caustics
« on: 2019-06-13, 18:06:17 »
There is one workaround, I will write it just for the sheer absurdity :- ).

Make two copies of the same light (one with Caustic On, one Off), each into separate LightSelect Layers and than you can see both Beauty+Caustic and Beauty without in LightMixer.

3
Hardware / Re: Threadripper Builds
« on: 2019-06-13, 18:00:38 »
I would take everything that cesspool of basement dwelling neckbeards write with bucket of salt on teen foot pole stick, but...

.. that is some over the top rumour ;- ). Looks like AMD will make for another very exciting year on CPU field. Sticking to CPU renderer isn't such an issue anymore.

I don't want to mention Silver Kitchen Appliance for Pros™ but it better watch out..

4
Hardware / Re: Threadripper Builds
« on: 2019-06-13, 17:16:09 »
I will be rebuilding this WS (7980XE) next week to also have water cooling, I kinda don't want to spend money on it but I already have it so I'll keep it for some time, at least until something 48c won't surface out.
I will run full suite of benchmarks afterwards as right now my AVX turbo (one I have to run with Corona) is not that high...

You did good waiting for Threadripper as it's better chip overall but surprisingly the scores in Corona aren't that far behind to Veronika's 2990WX. Cinebench R15 is different league, there it is behind ( 4400 points).

Even with delid this chip is terrible thermally and my NH-D15 is absolutely squeling :- ). Drives me insane hence the watercooling because I can't sell it, no one would buy it anymore.
(Did Jakub tell you he's keeping the PC in wardrobe lol).

5
General Discussion / Re: Some thoughts on Caustics
« on: 2019-06-13, 12:26:53 »
I will just put this small trick out here for desperate people: Render Caustics outside of beauty pass, and denoise them. Even Optix Denoiser creates magic out of them in matter of minutes.

6
Hardware / Re: Threadripper Builds
« on: 2019-06-13, 12:23:30 »
Absolutely. Any vendor who wouldn't would be massive fool. Look at what happened to prices of 1950X. Yes some shops always keeps their prices up for years, but everyone who actually wanted to sell that CPU did so with up to 60perc. discount. The CPU went for peanuts on bazaars/auctions.

The hype is so strong ! New benchmarks every day. It's crazy that it might obliterate my 18core i9 7980XE (with dellid!!).

7
Hardware / Re: Threadripper Builds
« on: 2019-06-13, 01:05:00 »


In C15 with PBO enabled im getting around 5500 points. Thats 31% difference (just with PBO) compared to new 16c unit. And that should be selling point if someone is deciding between new 16c vs 32c. Overclocked 2990wx can climb even higher.


That is very true, but it comes at higher cost. Overclocked 2990WX can reach beyond 500W draw (from nominal 250 TDP), that is such a massive heat it requires custom loop. Those loops Peter and I built cost 700+ Euro in parts alone.
The 3950X is 105 TDP chip. It will not go above 250W in draw whatsoever, so it will overclock on regular AIO loop without forcing the fans to spin at 2000 rpm. So it's a chip even non-enthusiast can overclock without much of investment, that's further value in price.

Anyway, it's not true contender for 2990WX. But it's fantastic that such chip can get to "masses" (so to speak..). Whethever it will live up to its hype, it's still sort of revolutionary.

This chip is direct contender for Intel's marketing stunt of i9 9990XE which after auctioned part, is selling for 2799 Euro !?!?!

https://www.caseking.de/en/intel-core-i9-9990xe-skylake-x-sockel-2066-tray-hpit-549.html

8
Now I see I come across as snarky, it's the work burnout. I am damn near close break down, I need rest. I guess I get annoyed by argument "I have this important friend...".

In our studio, it was network bottlenecking everything, esp. because our work load is so small in terms of images done we do 70perc. distributed rendering and only 30perc. one image per node method.
And recently, I almost reported it as issue because DR froze my workstation, until I realized my traffic came to absolute halt because those 10 Megapixels I used to transfer just fine became absurdly big files with 12+ LightSelect passes and denoise information (the CRX was like 10GB being sent from 4 nodes).
So for me, to make even 10gbit network crawl, is no issue at all.

There is nothing I can do with software bottleneck (and we already run highly overclocked i9 7980XE and 2990WX as our workstations), but my scenes happily open under 20 seconds (I run very little plugins, almost none). So additional 20 seconds that would take through traffic, would highly annoy me.

Last, it's absolute must to even get full random access speeds from any network SSD, I never care about sequential outside of our photographic work.


Regarding actual true fileserver vs NAS cost. It's not few hundreds we're talking that become insignificant. By the time we're talking 10 Sata inputs, and enough PCI-e lanes to feed multiple NVMe drives at same time, plus 1-2 10GBit nics extendability, the price difference becomes very high, and the NAS will still be utterly inferior in performance.
I am not against them, I had two Synology models but the price premium is for comfort, minimalism and hassle-free setup. But any semi-literate hardware enthusiast can setup all on regular PC and reap so many benefits.

For me, every single second of latency I can feel anywhere, is something I can't stand. And I am not alone this, you mentioned this point of single-core performance being very important in task-to-task haptics and people who migrate even from top-grade high-turbo Xeon models back to HEDT systems because they can't stand even the smallest perceivable latency, I see and feel the same difference between files flowing through 10gbe network from powerful fileserver.


Few years ago, you couldn't even get 10GBe NAS at <1k pricepoint. QNAP was the only one, Synology has 1.5k model. And they didn't even support retail parts. Now the situation is much better but for me the majority of NAS devices are not enough powerful for intensive access until we get to pricepoint where they don't longer make sense to me for non-corporate clients.

9
Which on a side note is more or less useless for our work, and a waste of money. Probably gonna get a lot of heat for saying this right now. But, believe me, I tried it I am still on it and I see no difference between scene loading times, render node loading times,

OK. 8-port Switch = 500 Euro now off eBay, 100 Euro per card. Waste of money indeed.

Did you measure it or just going "by the feel" ? Because it's night & day difference since I implemented it like 5 years ago. 3dsMax or Photoshop will load scenes forever regardless if the files are located directly on fastest drive in universe, but before applications will even open those scene, they still have to transfer them over the network, with our scenes being 1-2GB on average, that's 10-20 seconds vs 1 second before the scene even starts loading, makes a lot of difference already there. Not even talking multiple user-access at same time or loading multiple files.

But the biggest bottleneck is transferring high-resolution files (bigger the more passes are added) during distributed rendering, those Corona EXRs being sent can be in Gigabytes. To get quick and usable feedback, even 5-10Megapixels being sent every minute from multiple nodes can completely saturate 10GBit. Corona's DR is simply not usable on 1Gbit for higher resolutions.

(Unless maybe you have another friend with 50 employees who says otherwise, so then I cease this argument, 10Gbit is useless).

Quote
you will have to pay for Windows or Windows Server then you will have to pay for a file sync service like Syncbreeze

Both versions are 5-15 Euros from bulk OEMs, fully legal. SyncBreeze Pro 3 year 50 Euro. Adds up to hell of a lot.

10
Hardware / Re: Threadripper Builds
« on: 2019-06-12, 20:14:06 »
Yeah that. There is some penalty in Corona to Threadripper. I wondered why is that for long time. Regressing times with lower memory clocks would point towards the architecture itself (Inf Fab) but perhaps it's something potentially alleviable on software side.
I don't think Corona devs do this kind of testing though...and this is still software built upon Intel Framework. Do other Embree softs show such discrepancy ? Like Vray Next ?

11
Hardware / Re: Threadripper Builds
« on: 2019-06-12, 18:54:21 »
Yes, but it's also much lower TDP chip so with good enough cooling, and you don't usually render 24/7 all the time, that would still be years to survive just fine.

Some people are folding at these voltages.

But that's just record. Let's say you can get it under 1.4 for @4000 C15 points. That's still massive and already very sustainable.

We can just pray to rendering gods that somewhere, someday, Zen2 48C Threadripper will become reality.

12
Gallery / Re: For All Audiophiles
« on: 2019-06-12, 15:50:32 »
Thank you much :- )

13
Whoa, good I read this in time. I was also wondering why my BumpConverted Noise Maps (WorldXYZ) suddenly look only correct on half the objects in scene, I only recently upgraded those materials to BumpConverter as the result from procedurals is superior but...this is big trouble.

So is it necessary technical limitation ? Maybe it should come with warning or something. Can this be improved ?

14
Gallery / Re: For All Audiophiles
« on: 2019-06-12, 00:26:58 »
Whoa...how do you make those inset holes ? Sub-D mesh inside Sub-D mesh but separated by rather clean nonsubbed parts.

15
Hardware / Re: Threadripper Builds
« on: 2019-06-12, 00:23:49 »
The 3950X will be much better CPU than 1950/2950X Threadripper as long as the chiplet communication doesn't end up being secret bottleneck (As we already know from practice, Corona Renderer doesn't mirror more common multithreaded apps like Cinebench).
The Cinebench overclocked on air score is amazing, beyond 4000 points. You can't even get close to that with Zen1 Threadrippers. And yeah, CPU lanes, bla blah...look at the whole platform, it's already taken much more seriously by vendors than X399 sadly.

And what is trully tragic, you can already buy much better X570 boards for workstations than X399 has. There will be more 10gbit Workstation boards for X570 than X399 has in all those years.

So right now I wouldn't hold breath for Zen2 Threadrippers being around the corner.

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