Author Topic: Threadripper 2990WX  (Read 22291 times)

2018-08-13, 16:21:16

jpjapers

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I Noticed someone posted a benchmark today for the new 32 core amd ryzen threadripper 2990wx.
It had an x4 next to the cpu name. Is that using 4 of the processors? Or is it because there are 4 dies per processor?
The result was far from spectacular at 42 seconds. still WAY over the fastest xeon result but decent for a prosumer grade sku.
But still seeing that its double the core count of the previous 16 core threadripper at a decent clock speed its surprising that they only managed to shave off 15ish seconds.
« Last Edit: 2018-08-13, 16:40:15 by jpjapers »

2018-08-13, 16:47:15
Reply #1

3DsChobo

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It was tested using one threadripper at factory settings. So I guess the 4 stands for the dies within.
You can read the corresponding article here (they submitted the corona bench afterwards).
https://www.computerbase.de/2018-08/amd-ryzen-threadripper-2990wx-2950x-test/

The result is really good and can compete even with the Xeon 8180.
But the question is how the CPU will perforn on memory intense scenes, since the memory intertface has severe problems.

2018-08-13, 18:19:34
Reply #2

jpjapers

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It was tested using one threadripper at factory settings. So I guess the 4 stands for the dies within.
You can read the corresponding article here (they submitted the corona bench afterwards).
https://www.computerbase.de/2018-08/amd-ryzen-threadripper-2990wx-2950x-test/

The result is really good and can compete even with the Xeon 8180.
But the question is how the CPU will perforn on memory intense scenes, since the memory intertface has severe problems.

Its ppretty decent yeah im just surprised that it isnt quicker given i can hit 01:02 on my 16 core. granted at a higher clock speed. Its still pretty amazing though! Glad to see a drop in price of the 1950x too

2018-08-13, 19:07:49
Reply #3

PROH

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There's already a new benchmark at 37sec. There's also a benchmark for the 2950x at 1:04:99.

2018-08-13, 20:15:08
Reply #4

danio1011

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PCWorld has a video review that shows Corona scaling almost linearly above the 1950x (assuming both are at stock speeds.)

Right around 7:40:


I'm on an overclocked 1950x now.  Just waiting for a few more reviews and benchmarks to trickle out before I upgrade.  Almost 2x the performance seems worth it...

2018-08-13, 20:19:03
Reply #5

jpjapers

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PCWorld has a video review that shows Corona scaling almost linearly above the 1950x (assuming both are at stock speeds.)

Right around 7:40:


I'm on an overclocked 1950x now.  Just waiting for a few more reviews and benchmarks to trickle out before I upgrade.  Almost 2x the performance seems worth it...

Im still running an old 8 core amd FX on my home pc but now 1950x is going to be cheaper i might invest in a new rig. Im super impressed by AMD though they have kind of cornered the market when it comes for bang for buck cpus. Would be interesting to see what people cansqueeze out of it and what the closest intel sku is in terms of speed vs price.

2018-08-13, 21:26:37
Reply #6

danio1011

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Im still running an old 8 core amd FX on my home pc but now 1950x is going to be cheaper i might invest in a new rig. Im super impressed by AMD though they have kind of cornered the market when it comes for bang for buck cpus. Would be interesting to see what people cansqueeze out of it and what the closest intel sku is in terms of speed vs price.

1950X has treated me amazingly well.  The only glitch I ran into was having to return some non-compatible memory.  Super picky CPU that way.

2018-08-13, 21:28:24
Reply #7

jpjapers

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Im still running an old 8 core amd FX on my home pc but now 1950x is going to be cheaper i might invest in a new rig. Im super impressed by AMD though they have kind of cornered the market when it comes for bang for buck cpus. Would be interesting to see what people cansqueeze out of it and what the closest intel sku is in terms of speed vs price.

1950X has treated me amazingly well.  The only glitch I ran into was having to return some non-compatible memory.  Super picky CPU that way.

Yeah i built 4 1950x machines for work and the part selection was a bit of a pain but i think the new ryzen 16 core in the v2 range might be a bit easier.

2018-08-13, 22:40:16
Reply #8

danio1011

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Im still running an old 8 core amd FX on my home pc but now 1950x is going to be cheaper i might invest in a new rig. Im super impressed by AMD though they have kind of cornered the market when it comes for bang for buck cpus. Would be interesting to see what people cansqueeze out of it and what the closest intel sku is in terms of speed vs price.

1950X has treated me amazingly well.  The only glitch I ran into was having to return some non-compatible memory.  Super picky CPU that way.

Yeah i built 4 1950x machines for work and the part selection was a bit of a pain but i think the new ryzen 16 core in the v2 range might be a bit easier.

I’m just hoping my Taichi has enough juice to let me overclock the 2990wx a little.  Planning to do a 1 for 1 swap after a bios update.  Not sure what I’ll do with my old 1950x...maybe build a new machine, except RAM is so expensive.

2018-08-13, 23:00:16
Reply #9

jpjapers

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Im still running an old 8 core amd FX on my home pc but now 1950x is going to be cheaper i might invest in a new rig. Im super impressed by AMD though they have kind of cornered the market when it comes for bang for buck cpus. Would be interesting to see what people cansqueeze out of it and what the closest intel sku is in terms of speed vs price.

1950X has treated me amazingly well.  The only glitch I ran into was having to return some non-compatible memory.  Super picky CPU that way.

Yeah i built 4 1950x machines for work and the part selection was a bit of a pain but i think the new ryzen 16 core in the v2 range might be a bit easier.

I’m just hoping my Taichi has enough juice to let me overclock the 2990wx a little.  Planning to do a 1 for 1 swap after a bios update.  Not sure what I’ll do with my old 1950x...maybe build a new machine, except RAM is so expensive.

youd hope although ive heard people say its worrying the mobo manufacturers and might need extra cooling

2018-08-14, 01:26:58
Reply #10

agentdark45

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Interesting stuff going on here with Blender in Linux vs Windows comparisons:

https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=2990wx-linux-windows&num=4

Is the way windows is handling large core count CPU's whats crippling the performance or something else? I hear rumours that Windows' NUMA handling is abysmal. Across the board in any app tested on that site the Linux version seems to decimate the Windows variant...

Corona devs can you weigh in on this?
Vray who?

2018-08-14, 11:32:46
Reply #11

jpjapers

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Interesting stuff going on here with Blender in Linux vs Windows comparisons:

https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=2990wx-linux-windows&num=4

Is the way windows is handling large core count CPU's whats crippling the performance or something else? I hear rumours that Windows' NUMA handling is abysmal. Across the board in any app tested on that site the Linux version seems to decimate the Windows variant...

Corona devs can you weigh in on this?

Could it be that blender on linux is more optimised/faster than blender for windows? It would be interesting to see these tests with like a current gen i7 to see if its a standard thing.

2018-08-17, 18:06:32
Reply #12

danio1011

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Interesting to see a 36 second benchmark pop up @ 4ghz.  That's almost perfect scaling.  I think mine at 3.9ghz was around a minute.  Tempting, if I just knew that the Taichi would support OCing to 3.9 or so...

2018-08-23, 13:00:06
Reply #13

Juraj Talcik

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Our 2990WX is home :- ) This will be Veronika's new workstation.

Parts: 2990WX + MSI MEG X399 Creation / Seasonic Prime 1300W / 64 GB @ 3000 MHZ / 1 TB 960 PRO as main drive / 2TB + 2TB 960 EVO as secondary drives for photography / Shit ton of Noctua Cromax finally in black :- ) / U14S TR4 cooler, until second revision of Enermax Liqtech 360 ( II version, with stupid RGB ) is out and was widely tested for longevity ) / Define R6 / nVidia RTX, not sure which one yet
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2018-08-23, 13:33:45
Reply #14

Adam

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Our 2990WX is home :- ) This will be Veronika's new workstation.

Parts: 2990WX + MSI MEG X399 Creation / Seasonic Prime 1300W / 64 GB @ 3000 MHZ / 1 TB 960 PRO as main drive / 2TB + 2TB 960 EVO as secondary drives for photography / Shit ton of Noctua Cromax finally in black :- ) / U14S TR4 cooler, until second revision of Enermax Liqtech 360 ( II version, with stupid RGB ) is out and was widely tested for longevity ) / Define R6 / nVidia RTX, not sure which one yet

Very cool! Can't wait to get mine :D

2018-08-23, 16:30:18
Reply #15

agentdark45

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Our 2990WX is home :- ) This will be Veronika's new workstation.

Parts: 2990WX + MSI MEG X399 Creation / Seasonic Prime 1300W / 64 GB @ 3000 MHZ / 1 TB 960 PRO as main drive / 2TB + 2TB 960 EVO as secondary drives for photography / Shit ton of Noctua Cromax finally in black :- ) / U14S TR4 cooler, until second revision of Enermax Liqtech 360 ( II version, with stupid RGB ) is out and was widely tested for longevity ) / Define R6 / nVidia RTX, not sure which one yet

Nice setup Juraj! This is almost exactly what I'm looking at getting, except with a 2TB 970 EVO as the main drive. Can't seem to find the MSI MEG in stock anywhere in the UK though :'(

I have to say I'm SUPER skeptical about that Enermax cooler after all of the horror stories with the V1. I'm either going full custom waterloop or sticking the biggest aircooler I can find on it with as many fans as possible - this looks good: http://thermalright.com/product/silver-arrow-tr4/

What 64GB RAM kit did you get btw? I'm getting some mixed messages about what the best kit is to run at 3000mhz min speeds. People are concerned that the 2990wx memory controller won't be able to handle 64gb+ at those speeds/with decent timings.
Vray who?

2018-08-23, 17:02:53
Reply #16

Juraj Talcik

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Hey Agent :- )

- I found single available (right now) source of MSI MEG on CyberPort. Apparently it was in stock...but after I paid, it still says ready to ship in 24 hour...for the whole week. No idea when I will get it, but it's not in stock anywhere else in Europe.

- I went through the QVL list for days. Holy crap is that a shitty QVL list. 500 Euro workstation board...and they keep testing 8GB modules in 8/16/32 configurations ??? There are very few 16GB modules in 64GB/128GB configurations and most of them are not even brands you can buy in Europe. And of course, I am not gonna pay 1000 Euro for some idiotic Trident-Z G-Skill which isn't on the QVL in 16GB modules anyway despite being Threadripper exclusive. In the end I found Corsair Vengeance at 3000 Mhz (so 2933 manually running) that is not any sort of magical Samsung B-Die or whatever is hyped to work best, but it was 680 Euro on Amazon.de, and that is price I can sadly live with.
I seriously hope it will run well at 2933 and correct timings.

The QVL is nightmare. Even if I find something you can actually buy in Europe on it (Corsair, Crucial, Adata & G.Skill), find in on some e-shop or amazon/ebay, it will be some newer revision with single letter changed in name and of course completely different maker. The same Corsair kit can be made by Samsung in February, tested on QVL, but then discountinued in April because newer version made by Hynix entered market. AMD needs to sort this. Nobody has time for this.

- I am extremely skeptical of Enermax unit as well. This is 4000+ Euro workstation, I am not gonna let rusty pump leak all over it and destroy it during project and then haggle with warranty (which is never guaranteed). It is the only powerful cooler on the market though and apparently second revision is on market, but of course you can't buy it anywhere. So maybe in six months ?

- I don't know if I have patience and will to pay for custom loop. EK didn't even design their TR4 CPU block properly, it was pure failure last year and had worse performance than cheapest Air. They had revision afterwards but I still believe it sucks. I didn't check what sort of loop Deba8er was running on that fancy schmancy Epyc dual-loop at Gamescom but obviously there are better CPU block pieces now. Still, that would be another 400 Euro investment and the whole idea of Threadripper is that it is affordable. Paying for overpriced MSI board just because every other board is pure failed design from phases point is enough, but over-paying on everything (Board + memory + custom loop) is bringing the whole idea of this workstation into uncomfortable territory for me. I am not a guy who likes wasting money on frills and custom loop is very much a frill.

- Same about the Thermalight Silver Arrow TR4. Apparently this cooler is on market since June...then where is it ?? You can't buy this crap anywhere. I've seen people pre-ordering it on ebay Japan. This cooler looks like total nonexisting vaporware.
  If it enters the European market, I would buy it since it looks on par with Noctua NH-D15, which Noctu has NO intention of bringing to TR4 because apparently there isn't any market for it and they are too lazy to redesign it allow enough clearance over PCI-E and memory modules on such large socket.

I would not be such an early adopter with all this pain but Veronika really needs workstation right now so I just decided to go with it anyway.
« Last Edit: 2018-08-23, 17:12:10 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-08-23, 17:41:11
Reply #17

danio1011

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Great looking system!

It sounds like you've heard all the stories but for what it's worth I had an Enermax Liqtech 360 fail on me for my first gen threadripper.  Not fun, I'd keep a watchful eye on that thing.  I switched to Noctua and have been a lot happier while still running very cool (push\pull with an aggressive fan curve.)

2018-08-23, 17:49:46
Reply #18

Juraj Talcik

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Well, that sucks : /. Hope it didn't destroy anything in process.

I plan on placing additional A15PWM fan on the U14, not that it will do more than 2-3C difference but still. It's not like I have choice of going with anything else :- ).
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2018-08-25, 19:04:57
Reply #19

balatschaka

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Hey Agent :- )

- I found single available (right now) source of MSI MEG on CyberPort. Apparently it was in stock...but after I paid, it still says ready to ship in 24 hour...for the whole week. No idea when I will get it, but it's not in stock anywhere else in Europe.

- I went through the QVL list for days. Holy crap is that a shitty QVL list. 500 Euro workstation board...and they keep testing 8GB modules in 8/16/32 configurations ??? There are very few 16GB modules in 64GB/128GB configurations and most of them are not even brands you can buy in Europe. And of course, I am not gonna pay 1000 Euro for some idiotic Trident-Z G-Skill which isn't on the QVL in 16GB modules anyway despite being Threadripper exclusive. In the end I found Corsair Vengeance at 3000 Mhz (so 2933 manually running) that is not any sort of magical Samsung B-Die or whatever is hyped to work best, but it was 680 Euro on Amazon.de, and that is price I can sadly live with.
I seriously hope it will run well at 2933 and correct timings.

The QVL is nightmare. Even if I find something you can actually buy in Europe on it (Corsair, Crucial, Adata & G.Skill), find in on some e-shop or amazon/ebay, it will be some newer revision with single letter changed in name and of course completely different maker. The same Corsair kit can be made by Samsung in February, tested on QVL, but then discountinued in April because newer version made by Hynix entered market. AMD needs to sort this. Nobody has time for this.

- I am extremely skeptical of Enermax unit as well. This is 4000+ Euro workstation, I am not gonna let rusty pump leak all over it and destroy it during project and then haggle with warranty (which is never guaranteed). It is the only powerful cooler on the market though and apparently second revision is on market, but of course you can't buy it anywhere. So maybe in six months ?

- I don't know if I have patience and will to pay for custom loop. EK didn't even design their TR4 CPU block properly, it was pure failure last year and had worse performance than cheapest Air. They had revision afterwards but I still believe it sucks. I didn't check what sort of loop Deba8er was running on that fancy schmancy Epyc dual-loop at Gamescom but obviously there are better CPU block pieces now. Still, that would be another 400 Euro investment and the whole idea of Threadripper is that it is affordable. Paying for overpriced MSI board just because every other board is pure failed design from phases point is enough, but over-paying on everything (Board + memory + custom loop) is bringing the whole idea of this workstation into uncomfortable territory for me. I am not a guy who likes wasting money on frills and custom loop is very much a frill.

- Same about the Thermalight Silver Arrow TR4. Apparently this cooler is on market since June...then where is it ?? You can't buy this crap anywhere. I've seen people pre-ordering it on ebay Japan. This cooler looks like total nonexisting vaporware.
  If it enters the European market, I would buy it since it looks on par with Noctua NH-D15, which Noctu has NO intention of bringing to TR4 because apparently there isn't any market for it and they are too lazy to redesign it allow enough clearance over PCI-E and memory modules on such large socket.

I would not be such an early adopter with all this pain but Veronika really needs workstation right now so I just decided to go with it anyway.

Thanks for the insight. I've send my boss a list for new components (2990wx, msi-399 AND Enermax cooler) literally 5minutes ago. Changed it to Thermalight Silver Arrow TR4.
« Last Edit: 2018-08-25, 19:12:37 by balatschaka »

2018-08-28, 12:57:56
Reply #20

Jann

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A bit of a thread hijacking, but I'm finding conflicting info if Threadrippers (both 1&2 gen) support ECC Registered ram?
I know ram speed is beneficial for Ryzen, but with current ram prices, wonder if my old 128Gb 2133MHz ECC Reg set is worth keeping for a TR system.

2018-08-28, 13:05:06
Reply #21

Juraj Talcik

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Lot of the boards do support it straight out of bat, like Taichi for example:

https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/X399%20Taichi/index.asp

I've seen lot of people saying they have no issues at all, even saying the ECC functionality itself works under Server OS, not that it would matter to us ;- ).

But I don't see it under MSI MEG website, and since no one was able to test it yet (since no one outside of like 5 reviewers had the board), no answer can be found. You might try emailing them, but only some intern who will at best look up at the same public website will give you answer "Doesn't look like we support it".
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2018-08-28, 13:26:29
Reply #22

agentdark45

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Hey Agent :- )

- I found single available (right now) source of MSI MEG on CyberPort. Apparently it was in stock...but after I paid, it still says ready to ship in 24 hour...for the whole week. No idea when I will get it, but it's not in stock anywhere else in Europe.

- I went through the QVL list for days. Holy crap is that a shitty QVL list. 500 Euro workstation board...and they keep testing 8GB modules in 8/16/32 configurations ??? There are very few 16GB modules in 64GB/128GB configurations and most of them are not even brands you can buy in Europe. And of course, I am not gonna pay 1000 Euro for some idiotic Trident-Z G-Skill which isn't on the QVL in 16GB modules anyway despite being Threadripper exclusive. In the end I found Corsair Vengeance at 3000 Mhz (so 2933 manually running) that is not any sort of magical Samsung B-Die or whatever is hyped to work best, but it was 680 Euro on Amazon.de, and that is price I can sadly live with.
I seriously hope it will run well at 2933 and correct timings.

The QVL is nightmare. Even if I find something you can actually buy in Europe on it (Corsair, Crucial, Adata & G.Skill), find in on some e-shop or amazon/ebay, it will be some newer revision with single letter changed in name and of course completely different maker. The same Corsair kit can be made by Samsung in February, tested on QVL, but then discountinued in April because newer version made by Hynix entered market. AMD needs to sort this. Nobody has time for this.

- I am extremely skeptical of Enermax unit as well. This is 4000+ Euro workstation, I am not gonna let rusty pump leak all over it and destroy it during project and then haggle with warranty (which is never guaranteed). It is the only powerful cooler on the market though and apparently second revision is on market, but of course you can't buy it anywhere. So maybe in six months ?

- I don't know if I have patience and will to pay for custom loop. EK didn't even design their TR4 CPU block properly, it was pure failure last year and had worse performance than cheapest Air. They had revision afterwards but I still believe it sucks. I didn't check what sort of loop Deba8er was running on that fancy schmancy Epyc dual-loop at Gamescom but obviously there are better CPU block pieces now. Still, that would be another 400 Euro investment and the whole idea of Threadripper is that it is affordable. Paying for overpriced MSI board just because every other board is pure failed design from phases point is enough, but over-paying on everything (Board + memory + custom loop) is bringing the whole idea of this workstation into uncomfortable territory for me. I am not a guy who likes wasting money on frills and custom loop is very much a frill.

- Same about the Thermalight Silver Arrow TR4. Apparently this cooler is on market since June...then where is it ?? You can't buy this crap anywhere. I've seen people pre-ordering it on ebay Japan. This cooler looks like total nonexisting vaporware.
  If it enters the European market, I would buy it since it looks on par with Noctua NH-D15, which Noctu has NO intention of bringing to TR4 because apparently there isn't any market for it and they are too lazy to redesign it allow enough clearance over PCI-E and memory modules on such large socket.

I would not be such an early adopter with all this pain but Veronika really needs workstation right now so I just decided to go with it anyway.

Ah man tell me about it re RAM choice. I've been researching for weeks and still and undecided after checking various QVL lists. Am really quite annoyed that such a high end system doesn't have better RAM support. The other option was the Gigabyte Aorus extreme motherboard...which has marginally better support for 16GB dimms, but I hear their bios's are horrendous...so there's that.

I'm also undecided on going custom water as you're right, it's quite an expense. But I can't really see a viable alternative in the short term (lots of high end coolers still not on the market!).

Either way I'm kind of in the same boat - I need an upgrade asap for my dying Xeon system. Let me know how you get on with the build? I'm planning on putting everything together in the next 2 or so weeks.
Vray who?

2018-08-28, 13:49:41
Reply #23

Jann

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Lot of the boards do support it straight out of bat, like Taichi for example:

https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/X399%20Taichi/index.asp

I've seen lot of people saying they have no issues at all, even saying the ECC functionality itself works under Server OS, not that it would matter to us ;- ).

But I don't see it under MSI MEG website, and since no one was able to test it yet (since no one outside of like 5 reviewers had the board), no answer can be found. You might try emailing them, but only some intern who will at best look up at the same public website will give you answer "Doesn't look like we support it".
Yeah... ebay it is then :|
Better to get less, but supported memory.

2018-08-28, 13:53:06
Reply #24

Juraj Talcik

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Hey Agent,

I got DHL notice my MSI MEG is on way, so I hope it's here by Friday and I will build it immediately. More of my notes that might give you more insight :- )

- The memory controller is on the chip, so if one memory is on QVL of one MB maker, it should also "in theory" work on all other of same chipset. For most part. In practice, there seemed to be much issues with Asus boards, mainly their top Zenith. Ironical.
- With all the bios updates now done, I believe the worst that can happen is running at worse timing, but of course that's not ideal..

- I've double checked various loops in past two days because I second guessed myself. In the end the EKWB would start at 480 Euros, they have redesigned full-cover full-nickel CPU plate. Mind you, the performance difference compared to something like the Enermax AIO would be minimal, just because it has higher quality parts, doesn't mean it has any more dissipation power. Physics are physics, so the basic 480 Euro single 360/420mm radiator loop would simply run more silent due to high quality pump and bring more peace of mind but not better thermals.
- I believe dual-rad (2xthin 360mm rad) would offer performance advantage, but we're looking at 700-800 euro of investment.
- So yeah... not very economical thing for that additional 10perc. of performance. Depends how big is your render farm. If big, don't bother building ultra-station. If small, then maybe worth the investment.

- I've been told by Thermalight rep the Silver Arrow should be widely available in October. For some reason, all the cooler makers, including Coolermaster's Wraithripper are scheduled to enter market with the lower Threadrippers.
- I still don't know when the Enermax II will be available, but I would probably go for that instead of custom loop if you really want water. My guess is...again October.
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2018-08-29, 13:38:13
Reply #25

Juraj Talcik

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Any Chinese willing to help out :- ) ?

You can buy Thermalight Silver Arrow TR4 from Tmall, it's even in black ! Looks glorious.

https://detail.tmall.com/item.htm?spm=a220m.1000858.1000725.1.49f6137bfMYtPi&id=571526554977&skuId=3906628315202&user_id=3619201243&cat_id=2&is_b=1&rn=80a3137a510d2707a9e946da2136abff

I can't find it on any english-portal chinese sites though, just tmall.
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2018-08-29, 22:34:10
Reply #26

Juraj Talcik

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Well fuck it, I don't have time for that. Can't afford to wait another month, need this PC right now, might as well go all the way.

Ordered full EKWB water loop with their revised cpu block. I pondered Heat Killer IV but apparently the revised block is on same level so I'll keep it as single order.

This will be fun guys ;- ) Dual radiator setup...
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2018-08-30, 00:33:31
Reply #27

Gewiz90

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What ram did you go for?

2018-08-30, 00:47:28
Reply #28

danio1011

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Well fuck it, I don't have time for that. Can't afford to wait another month, need this PC right now, might as well go all the way.

Ordered full EKWB water loop with their revised cpu block. I pondered Heat Killer IV but apparently the revised block is on same level so I'll keep it as single order.

This will be fun guys ;- ) Dual radiator setup...

Wowwww...what a machine that will be.  You said you are building it for Veronika in your office?  How long before you steal it...or build a duplicate for yourself ;-)

Edit:  Random musing, but this whole discussion is kind of interesting when you think about GPU vs CPU.  If these RT cores actually do make for a faster experience, upgrading and expanding your GPUs is so much easier than a CPU.  Cooling, ram, etc all kind of go away in a sense.  I’m on the cusp of expanding a little bit and am pondering hardware, so it makes one think!
« Last Edit: 2018-08-30, 00:59:34 by danio1011 »

2018-08-30, 01:00:23
Reply #29

Juraj Talcik

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Well fuck it, I don't have time for that. Can't afford to wait another month, need this PC right now, might as well go all the way.

Ordered full EKWB water loop with their revised cpu block. I pondered Heat Killer IV but apparently the revised block is on same level so I'll keep it as single order.

This will be fun guys ;- ) Dual radiator setup...

Wowwww...what a machine that will be.  You said you are building it for Veronika in your office?  How long before you steal it...or build a duplicate for yourself ;-)

Yeah this one is hers :- ) I already built the i9 7980XE few months ago, although with bit disappointing thermals despite delid.

Btw, regarding the CPU vs GPU and ease of adding GPUs, you currently can't have both easily. All the hardcore boards like MSI-MEG coming up are 3-way SLI, like the makers didn't know SLI is dead and NVLink comes in pairs ?
To get the best out of NVLink with RTX cards, you can only use two or four cards to memory pool because three of them will have the third card lower the whole memory pool back to single card.

So if someone is thinking of going GPU in the future, think about this and buy motherboard that can actually take 4 dual-slot GPUs. MSI-MEG can't. So much for 500 Euro boards :- ).

I myself am pondering if it's finally the time for GPU rendering to make full on break-through. Pascal + RT Cores for performance, NVLink on consumer cards for double memory (2x2080ti=22GB Vram, a lot !!).
I can't wait for Vlado's publishing once NDA for RTX falls in September and see how the battle between VrayGPU and others will go.

But you're absolutely right about the ease. You could now build 4x2080ti Workstation (although for the same price you could build 8x1080ti...) which with pooled Vram would be like ultimate render-farm in one single case. It would be 8k euro machine but for what you would get in performance, everything in CPU world would pale in comparison. I can't even imagine those 1 minute renders in Redshift :- )

What ram did you go for?

Corsair Vengeance 3000 CL15 64(4x16). It's not Ryzen or TR specific, but it was like the only 4x16x3000+ tested on the QVL list :- ). Also, got it for 680 Euro of Amazon, which is lot better than the TR specific sets currently going for 1000 +/- Euros (funny enough, MSI didn't even test them for QVL... )
« Last Edit: 2018-08-30, 01:40:55 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-08-30, 03:48:34
Reply #30

danio1011

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Well fuck it, I don't have time for that. Can't afford to wait another month, need this PC right now, might as well go all the way.

Ordered full EKWB water loop with their revised cpu block. I pondered Heat Killer IV but apparently the revised block is on same level so I'll keep it as single order.

This will be fun guys ;- ) Dual radiator setup...

Wowwww...what a machine that will be.  You said you are building it for Veronika in your office?  How long before you steal it...or build a duplicate for yourself ;-)

Yeah this one is hers :- ) I already built the i9 7980XE few months ago, although with bit disappointing thermals despite delid.

Btw, regarding the CPU vs GPU and ease of adding GPUs, you currently can't have both easily. All the hardcore boards like MSI-MEG coming up are 3-way SLI, like the makers didn't know SLI is dead and NVLink comes in pairs ?
To get the best out of NVLink with RTX cards, you can only use two or four cards to memory pool because three of them will have the third card lower the whole memory pool back to single card.

So if someone is thinking of going GPU in the future, think about this and buy motherboard that can actually take 4 dual-slot GPUs. MSI-MEG can't. So much for 500 Euro boards :- ).

I myself am pondering if it's finally the time for GPU rendering to make full on break-through. Pascal + RT Cores for performance, NVLink on consumer cards for double memory (2x2080ti=22GB Vram, a lot !!).
I can't wait for Vlado's publishing once NDA for RTX falls in September and see how the battle between VrayGPU and others will go.

But you're absolutely right about the ease. You could now build 4x2080ti Workstation (although for the same price you could build 8x1080ti...) which with pooled Vram would be like ultimate render-farm in one single case. It would be 8k euro machine but for what you would get in performance, everything in CPU world would pale in comparison. I can't even imagine those 1 minute renders in Redshift :- )

What ram did you go for?

Corsair Vengeance 3000 CL15 64(4x16). It's not Ryzen or TR specific, but it was like the only 4x16x3000+ tested on the QVL list :- ). Also, got it for 680 Euro of Amazon, which is lot better than the TR specific sets currently going for 1000 +/- Euros (funny enough, MSI didn't even test them for QVL... )

Yes, exactly!  If VRay would only push the usability a little bit...material preview, VFB2, lightmix, LUT opacity slider.  It’s the little things that have been promised for so long, but man they make a difference day-to-day in Corona.

I’m holding on upgrading to the 2990wx until the NDA is lifted...

2018-08-31, 21:44:47
Reply #31

Juraj Talcik

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Ok, so not yet building anything this weekend.

My CyberPort order of MSI MEG x399 arrived today...and it was 100 euro MSI B450 instead ! :- D

There is not a single another copy in whole mainland Europe. Nowhere. So another two weeks. What a failed start for Threadripper. No boards, no coolers.

At least my EKWB loop came. I can build it and look how it cools nothing :- )

Seriously, look at this. Next time send gtx 1020 for 30 euros instead of RTX 2080ti because both are called "nVidia" on box.
« Last Edit: 2018-08-31, 23:28:21 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-08-31, 22:36:16
Reply #32

danio1011

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Ok, so not yet building anything this weekend.

My CyberPort order of MSI MEG x399 arrived today...and it was 100 euro MSI B450 instead ! :- D

There is not a single another copy in whole mainland Europe. Nowhere. So another two weeks. What a failed start for Threadripper. No boards, no coolers.

At least my EKWB loop came. I can build it and look how it cools nothing :- )

Seriously, look at this. Next time send gtx 1020 for 30 euros instead of RTX 2080ti because both are called "nVidia" on box.

Ah, that sucks!   Depending on your need and timeframe, you might have luck finding a Taichi in the meantime and flash the Bios to be compatible.  I have one and like it and I believe it can overclock the 2990wx.  Assuming your RAM is on the QVL list of course.  Just a thought, probably not worth it.
« Last Edit: 2018-08-31, 23:28:43 by Juraj Talcik »

2018-08-31, 22:47:19
Reply #33

Juraj Talcik

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You know what's funny, that Taichi, despite being "budget" sorta, and only ATX sized board, accomodates 4 dual-slot GPUs.

Massive and overpriced MSI, does not.

I will stick with MSI for now but only because I would like to have the phase support it offers. Taichi offers 8+3 which I am not that confident in.

Then there is Gigabyte Aorus Xtreme x399 with 10+3 phases. Better, but far cry from MSI. But it supports quad-GPU and has on board 10gbe, saving one pci-e slot.
Hmm, might look into it to see how stable it is under overclocking but I think there were like zero useful reviews of it because almost nobody got a copy.

Edit: Ok, great review by Kitguru guy. Still, that board is not available either :- D I found single copy in whole Europe from shop which doesn't send outside of Germany. Great.
I will wait for the MSI, what else.

(PS: Sorry for the "edit tag"...)
« Last Edit: 2018-08-31, 23:29:36 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-09-01, 00:00:58
Reply #34

danio1011

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You know what's funny, that Taichi, despite being "budget" sorta, and only ATX sized board, accomodates 4 dual-slot GPUs.

Massive and overpriced MSI, does not.

I will stick with MSI for now but only because I would like to have the phase support it offers. Taichi offers 8+3 which I am not that confident in.

Then there is Gigabyte Aorus Xtreme x399 with 10+3 phases. Better, but far cry from MSI. But it supports quad-GPU and has on board 10gbe, saving one pci-e slot.
Hmm, might look into it to see how stable it is under overclocking but I think there were like zero useful reviews of it because almost nobody got a copy.

Edit: Ok, great review by Kitguru guy. Still, that board is not available either :- D I found single copy in whole Europe from shop which doesn't send outside of Germany. Great.
I will wait for the MSI, what else.

(PS: Sorry for the "edit tag"...)

I was just about to send that review.  I knew I had seen people giving it good marks with the 2990wx.  Bummer about the availability.  For future build I can highly recommend the board.  I'm in the states so Newegg\Amazon are my go-to's when it comes to stuff.    Depending on 2080Ti benchmarks, etc. and if I decide to upgrade to a 2990wx I may or may not upgrade my mainboard.  I'm thinking of not upgrading and even just seeing how my Noctua does.  Keep costs as low as possible.  Or I just build a new system...not like I can get much for my 1950x now.

2018-09-01, 11:50:39
Reply #35

Juraj Talcik

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Leo just published review of the MSI board and it really is class of its own in terms of hardware. He even goes on to say OC (manual) on this board would be foolish since you can just up the watt cap and let it do its job.
He criticizes rightly the shit RGB all over and no 10GBe but that fades out.

So for the 32c 2990WX it doesn't look like any board is even remotely close.

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2018-09-01, 15:30:18
Reply #36

agentdark45

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Ok, so not yet building anything this weekend.

My CyberPort order of MSI MEG x399 arrived today...and it was 100 euro MSI B450 instead ! :- D

Wow this is some bull$hit!!! Hope you get it sorted asap.

Interesting review by Leo on the MEG, you can spot me in the comments asking about RAM haha. Pretty much sealed it for me for getting the MSI board seeing as the Asus and Gigabyte's VRM's were going over 100c when overclocking.

Any reason you went with the EK block vs something like the heatkiller one that topped out HardOCP's charts? To be fair though, I haven't seen any comparisons of the revised EK block - got any links to hand?

I'm still getting my head around how to go about setting up the loop (where to place fill/drain ports e.t.c).  I'm really liking the look of this case for watercooling: https://www.overclockers.co.uk/lian-li-pc-o11-dynamic-midi-tower-white-window-ca-76t-ll.html - I could set up a max of 3 radiators in it comfortably, and has mounting space for the pump/reservoir. I'm thinking of including some quick discconect fittings for the 2nd or 3rd rad so that I can add in a 2080ti later on (it looks like it's going to be a toasty beast due to the die size).

*Edit* if you manage to figure out how to order that Silver Arrow heatsink do let me know how as I might get it as a backup option in case I run into any issues with the loop.
« Last Edit: 2018-09-01, 15:34:34 by agentdark45 »
Vray who?

2018-09-01, 16:23:30
Reply #37

Juraj Talcik

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Yeah, the other boards do look like no-go for overclocking due to how overtheated the VRMs become.

The EK vs Heatkiller IV. I found comparison of revised EK to XSCP Raystorm which as you know is identical in performance to HK IV. So basically the takeaway was that HK IV=XSCP RS=Revised EK.
So for simplicity, best look, single invoice order, and better warranty (if you build the whole loop from single brand, they can't complain if something goes wrong) I went with the newest EK.

My loop will be extremely simple. 360 on top, 280 in front (the reason for not another 360 is because it's real struggle to access the top ports in Define as they get too close to each other), Pump/Reservoir combo mounted in front of front 280 rad as well as fill port.
I stayed with simple Define R6 as I like all boxes to look the same :- ). I only buy Fractal.
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2018-09-01, 16:23:57
Reply #38

psanitra

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I`m going for same build as you Juraj. I`m just patiently waiting  for couple more weeks for additional components reviews(coolers), but for now it seems i stick with Aorus extreme.  My main workload is FX in Houdini and rendering in Vray/Redshift with heavy GPU usage. Aorus have better PCI slots arrangements for me. I use 3 GPUs. I use 10Gbit network at home from my slave machines and NAS. PCIe setup with Aorus works great. With MSI , there is no 10Gb nic and PCIe slots arragement on MSI will not allow for 3GPUs(2 slot each) + 10Gb PCIe card.

For the RAM,i need 128GB.  MSI QVL list for 128GB, pretty much no choices. But i found multiple kits from G.Skill that works with both MSI and Aorus. Just check here if you missed it

https://www.gskill.com/en/catalog/desktop-memory , they actually list QVL board types :)  Aorus have more then ten 128GB kits in QVL list. So better then MSI in this  aspect.

MSI looks great on VRMs, but that`s pretty much it.  If i can do 5000-5400 Cinebench on Aorus fine with me. To be able to get to additional 5500-6000 it`s getting really expensive with any board. Power consumption, custom loop cooling, better rams, not mentioning sitting in room with 1KW heating all the time.  My conclusion is that the stretch for another 5-7% performance is not worth the trouble/expenses/comfort.

cheers and looking forward for photos of your build

Peter
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2018-09-01, 16:48:49
Reply #39

Juraj Talcik

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Hi Peter ! :- ) What a pleasant surprise to have legend like you here.

Absolutely agree with your choices. If we were using GPU rendering I would absolutely go for the Aorus instead. Lot more reasonable layout and better board overall. Since the most we're gonna dabble in GPU rendering for now might be Unreal engine, I think two GPU's will have to suffice. Even if we were to fully swap to GPU rendering in future (in year or two) I don't think either of us would install more than 2 GPUs at once since I would still like to offload that to our farm (where I can still fit 4 full GPUs onto each of our many xeon machines).

Could you not fit 3 GPUs + 1 Ethernet card by fitting the GPUs in the top first, and the lowest two and the Ethernet card into third from top under the top GPU ?
Still, I would not go for 3-slot only board for GPU rendering. MSI did really strange choice here.

The MSI is strange board and I openly admit I do plan to buy it purely for the phases with some reservations. But our workflow right now is 99perc. Corona so why not get the most out of it if I can is the whole philosophy.

I did check the G.Skill QVL as well, but when I did that the MSI MEG wasn't even there yet and for other MSI boards there it was super limited.
I originally wanted to get 64 GB to keep the costs reasonable but now that I went all out with watercooling, I might swap to 128 as well.

1KW each machine..no need to tell me about the kind of sauna in creates :- ). I installed 4KW AC this summer in our office room. 36C outside + 3 PCs running wasn't very pleasurable experience last summer.

« Last Edit: 2018-09-01, 17:02:53 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-09-03, 13:51:40
Reply #40

Juraj Talcik

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Update regarding MSI MEG x399 situation:

Quote
...according to the distributer information I currently doubt this date and count with the product not before the end of september.

End of September lol. Did they make a grand total of 10 units and gave them all to reviewers ?

Just checked out all the shops. Zero units in Europe, 3 units in USA, all to ship between 18th September and early October.
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2018-09-03, 16:30:03
Reply #41

Jann

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For what it's worth, some local e-shops show the Gigabyte Aorus Xtreme x399 for order, but with shipping time 15-19 september. Soo, not much sooner.
It's almost like MSI and Gigabyte don't want the free advertising such extreme builds bring for them :|

2018-09-03, 16:38:14
Reply #42

Juraj Talcik

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For what it's worth, some local e-shops show the Gigabyte Aorus Xtreme x399 for order, but with shipping time 15-19 september. Soo, not much sooner.
It's almost like MSI and Gigabyte don't want the free advertising such extreme builds bring for them :|

I would say it's almost like they just don't want to sell any of those two boards at all :- ).

Truth be told I would go with Aorus since I like it more, but now that I have all this cooling, I have to stick with the overclocking board :- ).

Still, this is baffling. Selling boards and coolers two months after selling the CPUs ?
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2018-09-06, 23:47:33
Reply #43

Juraj Talcik

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I am starting to get a suspicion that reason for delay across the world is due to revision (even if the revision is just out-of-the-box newer Uefi).

There is only miniscule amount of these boards out (outside of reviewers, but even those I can count of two hands) and already quite few of "stuff just freezes".
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2018-09-07, 00:53:20
Reply #44

danio1011

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I am starting to get a suspicion that reason for delay across the world is due to revision (even if the revision is just out-of-the-box newer Uefi).

There is only miniscule amount of these boards out (outside of reviewers, but even those I can count of two hands) and already quite few of "stuff just freezes".

Hum.  That’s disconcerting but not surprising given past events.  I think I’ll be holding on my 2990wx build for a little while.

2018-09-07, 14:07:35
Reply #45

psanitra

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I am starting to get a suspicion that reason for delay across the world is due to revision (even if the revision is just out-of-the-box newer Uefi).

There is only miniscule amount of these boards out (outside of reviewers, but even those I can count of two hands) and already quite few of "stuff just freezes".

Hey Juraj, most of the issues with x399 board and 29xx series seem to be coming from memory. Related to timings and frequency mostly but i guess you already know that. Recently i follow  lot of threads about it.  Meg gets discussed a lot but it seems it`s bios related mostly . There is good thread here with links to MSI alpha bios version and progress

https://www.overclock.net/forum/10-amd-cpus/1705286-ryzen-threadripper-2990wx-2970wx-2950x-2920x-owners-club-11.html

Larry B. there is actually guy who did the ryzen Dram calculator which helps to solve a lot of mem issues.

https://www.overclock.net/forum/13-amd-general/1640919-ryzen-dram-calculator-1-1-0-beta-2-overclocking-dram-am4.html

I have all my stuff already ordered, went for Aourus Extreme 128GB RAM.  Kit is https://www.gskill.com/en/product/f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx , both Meg an Aorus are on QVL lis, and i found people on forums running these mem sticks with the  Meg, Zenith too. Unfortunately i have to wait 10 days for ram kit , ordered directly from G.skill as there were zero pieces in stock in Europe.

Looking forward for your build updates :)


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2018-09-07, 14:16:47
Reply #46

Juraj Talcik

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So how much did the memory run you :- ) ?

The UEFI (bios) thing is rather strange given these boards came specifically for the TR gen2. Honestly have no idea what could have gone wrong for board that had one job exactly on market entrance.

The build I am going for will be real fun, not gonna post it yet as I revised both the case choice and loop. Bit crazy..
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2018-09-07, 14:28:38
Reply #47

psanitra

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I had to sell my kidney to get that RAM :D  , 1650Eur

For cooling i did change my plans too and went for 2x360 rads.., should be good up to 800W at 10 Celsius delta... , heatkiller iv pro block

For case, R6 was obvious choice, i have R5s now , But then i saw Phanteks Evolve X and  i just could not resist , looks amazing and more space on top for rads then R6..
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2018-09-10, 15:06:56
Reply #48

Juraj Talcik

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Board finally came ! :- ) Just waiting for the case here, should come in 3-4 days.
(Looks battered as hell on photo, but the board is fine, no worry)







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2018-09-10, 15:16:50
Reply #49

romullus

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Holy crap, is this PC motherboard or spare part for some transformer?
I'm not Corona Team member! Everything i say, is my personal opinion only. Render Legion does not endorse my words nor actions.

2018-09-10, 15:38:26
Reply #50

Juraj Talcik

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It's horribly ugly :- ). But those "deconstructed" elements are just pieces of plastics glued onto black square metallic heat sinks.

I would remove them..but that would complicate the warranty process, which isn't best idea for 600 euro board.
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2018-09-10, 15:42:24
Reply #51

Vuk

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Looks great! I now have available to order the X399 Aorus Extreeme in Hungary and its 450 euros. It's such a tease but I will try to wait 2 more months more just to get a better picture of what is available and best to buy at the moment of purchase... Can't wait to see you Corona bench scores though!

2018-09-10, 15:45:35
Reply #52

Juraj Talcik

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Originally I had bunch of orders at 480 +/- euro from german e-shops, but it all proved to be bust. Local big shop got a copy for 580 so I grabbed that one. I believe this will be the "new" price from now on mostly.

https://www.kitguru.net/components/leo-waldock/msi-meg-x399-creation-the-best-motherboard-ever/

The best motherboard ever would be Aorus layout (4 dual-slot GPUs) + Aorus features (10gbe) + MSI hardware (19 phases), but right now knowing I will never put more than two GPUs inside, it's MSI.
But from the chart you can see if your intended overclock is 3.6 + 3.8 +/- , Aorus should be enough but I would still treasure the stability the additional phases bring to table (35 Degree C difference on VRM)

Lol at Zenith, 120 degree C at 3.8Ghz. Better install that tiny 4cm fan "kit". "Overclocker's dream board".

Who knows what X499 will bring.
« Last Edit: 2018-09-10, 16:25:15 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-09-10, 17:12:40
Reply #53

psanitra

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Originally I had bunch of orders at 480 +/- euro from german e-shops, but it all proved to be bust. Local big shop got a copy for 580 so I grabbed that one. I believe this will be the "new" price from now on mostly.

https://www.kitguru.net/components/leo-waldock/msi-meg-x399-creation-the-best-motherboard-ever/

The best motherboard ever would be Aorus layout (4 dual-slot GPUs) + Aorus features (10gbe) + MSI hardware (19 phases), but right now knowing I will never put more than two GPUs inside, it's MSI.
But from the chart you can see if your intended overclock is 3.6 + 3.8 +/- , Aorus should be enough but I would still treasure the stability the additional phases bring to table (35 Degree C difference on VRM)

Lol at Zenith, 120 degree C at 3.8Ghz. Better install that tiny 4cm fan "kit". "Overclocker's dream board".

Who knows what X499 will bring.

Well said.Sadly we can`t have best of both worlds on eATX, and there are no proper x399 workstation boards(WTF). But those VRM on MSI are godly indeed.  I read that article earlier today too, and was quite happy about it. My Aorus should be ok for mid range overclock, exactly what i`m aiming for.  I hope i can tear down that plastic piece of sh** from the top VRM heatsink too, and put two small 30mm fans there to knock down few degrees from VRMs.

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2018-09-10, 17:22:45
Reply #54

Juraj Talcik

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After reading all about the MSI, I had contemplated replacing my x299 board (ROG STRIX-E with 8 phases and only 8+4 pins) on my i9 7980XE workstation. All the "WS" grade boards (like the mammoth Asus SAGE) had surprisingly 8 phases once again. While something much cheaper like AsRock Taichi XE had 13 phases (for CPU only, the much more expensive fatality had 12+2 for memory, so 13 for CPU was the highest of all x299 series.
Funny how x299 boards now start at 200 euros brand new, shows how much that platform really "took off". I expect the same of x599 if it actually materializes at some point.
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2018-09-10, 17:27:26
Reply #55

nerfherder

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This thread has been super helpfull for me - my 2990wx and msi board arrived today. I picked the msi based mainly on the vrm and mainly steered towards it from this thread.
All I need now is to find some in stock memory, wait for the Evolv x to be released (or ditch it and go back to Fractal), and wait for the Enermax Liqtech II to be released! I’ve also got massive reservations about the Enermax, but without going custom water cooled and worrying that an air cooler won’t get the temps down enough I’m stuck as to an option.
I never thought the hardest part of this build would be giving shops my money.....

2018-09-10, 17:36:06
Reply #56

Juraj Talcik

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Enermax Liqtech II release date is truly strange. It was being sold on Newegg only but it's not there anymore, not even as "out of stock". It just vanished :- ). I would write them to ask about this (Enermax).

Looks like majority of the units that got made are within prebuilt configurations.

Case: Stick with Fractal for AIO or Air cooler, go with something else for custom loop (like the Evolve). The tall VRM heatsink on MSI is trouble-causer :- ). I need to measure it.
« Last Edit: 2018-09-10, 17:42:35 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-09-10, 18:18:12
Reply #57

psanitra

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Juraj, are you going for top radiator too? PE thickness?  It`s tight up there, one of the reasons i go for Evolve X, more space then R6 on top.  The only issue... have to wait for Evolve X 3weeks.. Fans pretty much have to overlap the board... and that VRM heatsink is high..

here is Evolve X with dual 360 rads


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2018-09-10, 18:46:59
Reply #58

Juraj Talcik

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I already returned the Define R6. One of the reason I want to show the final case once I start building is I am sort of embarased by the choice :- ) I saw it one of two lesser evils, with the one I chose at least being sort of exotic/unorthodox instead of cosmic shapes.
It hurts my heart Define XL3 doesn't exist.

I am going for 45mm 420mm top radiator with 3x pull 140mm fans, and 60mm 360mm rad in front with 6x120mm push/pull fans.
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2018-09-10, 18:51:50
Reply #59

nerfherder

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Yeap, that top space is my main reason for wanting an Evolv to shove as big a rad in there as possible. Sept 24th seems to be the realise date. Agree with you that a XL3 would be great, I use a XL2 which I love, but now I’ve ended up with an rgb motherboard it seems a shame not to see it 😏

2018-09-10, 18:54:59
Reply #60

Juraj Talcik

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but now I’ve ended up with an rgb motherboard it seems a shame not to see it 😏

Heresy :-)
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2018-09-10, 19:01:32
Reply #61

psanitra

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Lol, same here. It`s going to be "rainbow is magic" build , Aorus + G.Skill RGB RAM + glass side panel. 
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2018-09-11, 11:07:04
Reply #62

Vuk

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Originally I had bunch of orders at 480 +/- euro from german e-shops, but it all proved to be bust. Local big shop got a copy for 580 so I grabbed that one. I believe this will be the "new" price from now on mostly.

https://www.kitguru.net/components/leo-waldock/msi-meg-x399-creation-the-best-motherboard-ever/

The best motherboard ever would be Aorus layout (4 dual-slot GPUs) + Aorus features (10gbe) + MSI hardware (19 phases), but right now knowing I will never put more than two GPUs inside, it's MSI.
But from the chart you can see if your intended overclock is 3.6 + 3.8 +/- , Aorus should be enough but I would still treasure the stability the additional phases bring to table (35 Degree C difference on VRM)

Lol at Zenith, 120 degree C at 3.8Ghz. Better install that tiny 4cm fan "kit". "Overclocker's dream board".

Who knows what X499 will bring.

I totally agree with you on this one. Would always go for the board with more phases but for me its still not available right now so I will probably wait until it gets out in the local shops or something even better shows up. I have my hopes in As Rock for this segment. Although I am not a big fan of them they always excelled at making boards capable for high overcloking.

2018-09-11, 11:38:56
Reply #63

Juraj Talcik

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I am surprised how disappointing the late Asus boards are. They used to have top-grade models but now it looks like it's all fancy heatsinks and branding. It's ok to have that but at least coupled with performance, but for them it's lately just the visage.

The gaming oriented branding has been nothing but poor choice for prosumer market. But I guess the marketing departments have done their research and figured out it's actually lot more gamers and enthousiasts buying this stuff regardless of how useless it is for them.
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2018-09-11, 12:38:00
Reply #64

Fluss

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Yeap, that top space is my main reason for wanting an Evolv to shove as big a rad in there as possible. Sept 24th seems to be the realise date. Agree with you that a XL3 would be great, I use a XL2 which I love, but now I’ve ended up with an rgb motherboard it seems a shame not to see it 😏

Don't worry, phanteks cases are best in class ! I prefer my enthoo pro over my XL2, good cable management, removable drive cage, better cooling, proper SSI EEB mounting etc etc... Just a bit noisier. That's not a problem as my prosafe xs708e cover them all 10 times :)

2018-09-12, 10:35:48
Reply #65

nerfherder

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Yeah, I've had a look round for other cases, and keep coming back to the Evolv X - I'll just have to wait until later this month to get my hands on one. Do Phantexs not realise that my other workstations are struggling and that I need to get building?!

Has anyone got any good suggestions for power supplies? I think I need to get around 1200w, and will probably get something from EVGA as I've used them before and had no problems, but if anyone knows a better option I'm all ears....

2018-09-12, 10:54:21
Reply #66

Radim Razzak

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Yeah, I've had a look round for other cases, and keep coming back to the Evolv X - I'll just have to wait until later this month to get my hands on one. Do Phantexs not realise that my other workstations are struggling and that I need to get building?!

Has anyone got any good suggestions for power supplies? I think I need to get around 1200w, and will probably get something from EVGA as I've used them before and had no problems, but if anyone knows a better option I'm all ears....

I don't know about other brands, but I quite like Corsair PSUs with i-link, which allows you to monitor different values of motherboard, CPUs, RAMs, VGA and PSU itself. I've had many Corsair PSUs and never had a single problem. I still use a 10 years old Corsair HX520 in one of my machine and no problem at all...

2018-09-12, 13:31:06
Reply #67

Juraj Talcik

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My personal opinion is that there is no need to go for anything different than Seasonic unless you're budget shopping or have peculiar need for warranty ( like US region where warranty is otherwise limited).

Corsair, BeQuite, EVGA and other reputable brands source their PSU from various OEMs like Seasonic, Super Flower, Channel Well,etc.
So particular Corsair AX can be made by Seasonic, but AXi by Flextronics & Chicony.

And seriously, do you want Seasonic or Chicony to manufacture your high-end 200+ Euro PSU ? Just get Seasonic.

There is hardly anything better than Seasonic Prime models (G/P/T) on the market right now, it's the latest&greatest. Unparalleled build quality, look at any review.

The only tiny critique I have ever seen on Prime could be sometimes more aggressive fan curve, but this isn't going to be an issue if you go over 1k watt (and you should do that for 2990WX + 1 or 2 GPUs) and I personally find it still super silent.
I have used Prime Titanium for file server and Prime Gold for past two workstations I've build. Will also use Prime Gold 1200W this time.
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2018-09-12, 15:30:47
Reply #68

psanitra

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I use multiple corsairs 1000W and 1200W in my builds and they all worked fine in past 5 years. For this new 2990wx + 3GPU build i picked their best model AX1600i

https://www.anandtech.com/show/12645/the-corsair-ax1600i-psu-review-unparalleled-performance/6
« Last Edit: 2018-09-12, 16:23:48 by psanitra »
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2018-09-12, 16:59:33
Reply #69

Gewiz90

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Why is the Enermax Liqtech II better than any other AIO Cooler? is it worth the wait or do I get an Evga clc280?

2018-09-12, 17:07:25
Reply #70

Juraj Talcik

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Why is the Enermax Liqtech II better than any other AIO Cooler? is it worth the wait or do I get an Evga clc280?

Because it's the only one available with full heatspreader coverage for TR4 (We're only talking in context of this platform, not generally for AIOs), which has been proved to be necessary for Threadripper both for <=16 cores if you want overclocking, or >16 cores to even run properly without throttling as you need to dissipate 250 Watts (without overclocking, with overclocking 500W+).
Any air cooler with full heatspreader coverage (like Noctua NH-U14 TR4 or Silver Arrow ) will be much better choice than AIO with smaller CPU block (retained by adapter basically).

I know a lot of people with 280/360mm AIOs like Kraken NZXT on their 1950X where it sorta ok job for base clocks, or slight overclock + noisy. But absolutely no-go for 2990WX.

For this new 2990wx + 3GPU build i picked their best model AX1600i

https://www.anandtech.com/show/12645/the-corsair-ax1600i-psu-review-unparalleled-performance/6

You did tell your girlfriend/wife how much you're spending right :- ) ?
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2018-09-12, 18:22:55
Reply #71

psanitra

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Quote
You did tell your girlfriend/wife how much you're spending right :- ) ?

She approved after i told her that PSU it`s powerful enough to run all kitchen appliances too :D
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2018-09-13, 16:40:53
Reply #72

nerfherder

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My personal opinion is that there is no need to go for anything different than Seasonic unless you're budget shopping or have peculiar need for warranty ( like US region where warranty is otherwise limited).

Corsair, BeQuite, EVGA and other reputable brands source their PSU from various OEMs like Seasonic, Super Flower, Channel Well,etc.
So particular Corsair AX can be made by Seasonic, but AXi by Flextronics & Chicony.

And seriously, do you want Seasonic or Chicony to manufacture your high-end 200+ Euro PSU ? Just get Seasonic.

There is hardly anything better than Seasonic Prime models (G/P/T) on the market right now, it's the latest&greatest. Unparalleled build quality, look at any review.

The only tiny critique I have ever seen on Prime could be sometimes more aggressive fan curve, but this isn't going to be an issue if you go over 1k watt (and you should do that for 2990WX + 1 or 2 GPUs) and I personally find it still super silent.
I have used Prime Titanium for file server and Prime Gold for past two workstations I've build. Will also use Prime Gold 1200W this time.

Thanks for that - I think I probably end up going Seasonic too (although I did consider Corsair's HXi range too). I reckon either of those, or even an EVGA or Super Flower would be good, but I need to make sure I buy from someone with good customer service in case of  failure (reading to many customer reviews on the net has probably made me overly cautious).

The cooling options are still limited - Enermax aren't saying when Liqtech II is out, and it might be as unreliable as the first version. Cooler Master have a TR4 AIO due but they don't know seem to when its out either. Right now I'm starting to think going custom with EK might be my best option, and it might be fun?!?


You did tell your girlfriend/wife how much you're spending right :- ) ?

I'm going to wait until I can show her the Corona Benchmark results - I'm sure she'll be impressed enough to not worry about the cost........

2018-09-13, 17:27:03
Reply #73

Juraj Talcik

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One friend told me yesterday, while he was building his 2990WX, his shop told him two weeks to get LiqTech II. Swiss shop, so I guess it's around. (I mean it is on market already, but all within prebuild systems).
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2018-09-13, 21:47:46
Reply #74

nerfherder

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Well I'm going to be waiting a few more weeks probably for the case, so maybe by then it will be available. If not, I'll go custom (I've already specced out a loop on the EKWB website).
The irony is I'm sitting here watching my current system really struggle with the work I'm throwing at it while the solution sits idle on my desk in a box :(

2018-09-13, 22:01:26
Reply #75

Juraj Talcik

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Yeah that is the reason I went for the EKWB loop as well. It's the only ultimate non-compromise choice and it is available immediately.
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2018-09-13, 22:32:29
Reply #76

Juraj Talcik

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I thought some of you might like this review.

TL,DR: They had shit board with poor mounting issue ( the infamous Foxconn issue). I don't think this extrapolates well to something like MSI MEG which reports none of this.

Heatkiller IV is still the best. If you apply properly TIM and pressure, all other perform the same within single degree.

https://www.xtremerigs.net/2018/08/29/amd-threadripper-cpu-block-review-round-up/11/

(Personally, I am staying with the EKWB unit since I won't have any mounting&pressure issue on MSI MEG and I like the pre-mounted setup)
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2018-09-14, 18:46:40
Reply #77

nerfherder

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Thanks for that - good info, but I think I'll go with EKWB as well, mainly because they have a good system config tool on their website which makes the ordering process less scary for a watercooling novice like me (and I've heard lots of positive feedback about them).

2018-09-16, 11:05:20
Reply #78

Karolis

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Hey guys, sorry to jump in. Juraj, would it be possible for you to post some comparison of viewport performance in 3ds Max between 2990wx and 7980xe? There are a lot of rendering reviews but I'm especially wondering how the 2990wx performs while modelling or navigating the viewport since it has not so good reviews regarding gaming.

Thanks a lot

2018-09-16, 17:56:22
Reply #79

Juraj Talcik

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I think I could do that but we only have one 1080ti and other Titan-X(Maxwell) which are unequal and I am bit lazy swapping it. Also, we're still on 2016 which has very smooth viewport as long as scene fits into VRAM (the moment our scenes overflow Veronika's previous 8GB of GTX 1070, the performance loss was brutal...like 95perc. From 100fps to zero fps.

After recent Geforce driver patches, the perfomance seems more than ok.

If anyone is interested I would gladly sell my (delidded) i9 7980XE and swap it for 2990WX :- ). I do not care for where it is slower. If I won't sell it, I will put it under brutal water loop same as the 2990WX.

Hey, pictures tomorrow btw ! Will finish this tonight.

« Last Edit: 2018-09-16, 18:10:00 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-09-16, 18:52:28
Reply #80

Gewiz90

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Can you share your EKWB part list?

2018-09-16, 18:58:59
Reply #81

Bzuco

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Nice photo, looks like MATTONI inside loop? :))

2018-09-16, 19:02:56
Reply #82

Juraj Talcik

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Yeah, after fill :- ) It's not like that anymore, still a bit to bleed out but nothing inside loop.

Will put list of course.
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2018-09-16, 20:56:14
Reply #83

Karolis

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Thanks for the reply. How much do you want for the dellided 7980xe? :)

2018-09-16, 21:40:42
Reply #84

Juraj Talcik

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I need to run the most important benchmark, Witcher 3 :- ). But shoot me an email (on my website) if you're interested.

Edit: I love this thing. Tried automatic PBO since I don't know how to set the other two Amper values (I know Kitguru's magic trinity but I don't how he came across them, will try tomorrow), but got it above 5900 CB15 points without sweat (3.8-3.9Ghz) and the fans do not even need to start spinning.
« Last Edit: 2018-09-17, 00:30:33 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-09-17, 01:08:53
Reply #85

nerfherder

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Looks great! Can't wait to get started on my build, those CB points look very promising.

2018-09-17, 01:21:10
Reply #86

Juraj Talcik

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Yeah, the BIOS less so... Lot of benign changes result in occassional 06 (microcode loading) issue after restart. Simply starting again solves it. No issue during run-time whatsover, no issue with stability. Just the 06 q-code issue.

I found quite few people with that already on forums, doesn't look like there is any more recent uefi file public (13th August is the last one), will not risk their private beta uefi yet.

Edit1: Ok I have July 23rd uefi, will test the August build.
Edit2: Solved microcode loading. Uefi still confusing mess to me. Smart fan speed control will randomly loose on/off, setting jet-engine. It remember the settings under smart fan speed, but not the status. Was able to replicate the issue like five times in row, sending email to support.
Edit3: Nope, not solved. Looks like smart fan speed is enough to bring this board to knees.... back to 06 q-code. Fuck it for tonight.

Can you believe this crap ?

Quote
The fan control is a bit difficult when you overclock your memory. MSI does some 'stuff' to step up the speed of the fans to cool more if your memory speed is over 2750 MHz. It's an undocumented feature (right now) that I only learned about earlier this week after inquiring them about it.

Now this explains all the trouble with A-XMP and Fan control. It doesn't play together. Will try ignoring XMP and set memory manually.
edit: Nope, I have no idea how to keep overclocked memory and Smart fan control. Overclocked memory basically resets the setting to OFF automatically after boot. I will send MSI email they have never seen before.

Look at this crazy advice from MSI forum dev;

Quote
If you want to use smart fan mode while overclocking,
then please change OC settings in BIOS, change fan mode in BIOS, save and exit and do not go back to BIOS.
https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=307570.0

Which will just result in Q-Code issue anyway. No way to "cheat it". MSI knows better than you ! Christ, they created overclocker's board, which doesn't let you control fucking fans !! And they will even admit it is "design decision".

Last Edit: PC is stable, Memory running at A-XMP profile 2, should be 2800 only but Windows refers to it as 2933 so I don't know. Fans are controlled. Can restart how many times I want, will boot 100perc. each time. Except..

... I can't go into UEFI again without fucking this all over. So I basically have 500 Euro board which is "Set it but please don't touch again". Glorious. Just glorious :- D
« Last Edit: 2018-09-17, 03:21:49 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-09-17, 06:42:39
Reply #87

danio1011

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That sounds rather touchy.  Would you get that board again?

I just watched a random review of VRM performance vs an overclocked 2990wx and while the MEG is the best performer, the trusty Taichi did decent:


Thinking I might get my new build on or around Black Friday.  I wish there was a ‘perfect’ motherboard option!

2018-09-17, 11:25:39
Reply #88

agentdark45

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... I can't go into UEFI again without fucking this all over. So I basically have 500 Euro board which is "Set it but please don't touch again". Glorious. Just glorious :- D

Damn, this is pretty crazy. I'm currently getting mine built by overclockers UK with a full EK loop (nice 3 year warranty that includes against leaks), but I don't like the sound of those motherboard issues! What's annoying is that there's literally no viable alternative board if you're looking to OC the 2990wx.
Vray who?

2018-09-17, 11:33:42
Reply #89

psanitra

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Fingers crossed Juraj for the build/testing. It seems all 2nd gen boards have bios issues. I was very disappointed last night what i saw what kind of mess  Aorus xtreme bios is


And on top of that windows scheduler stuff..., this build will need a lot of patience.. 

For everybody going 2990wx, Wendel from Lvl1 tech have plenty of good info about 2990wx and numa/threading/scheduling stuff and how to optimize the performance. I tried process lasso on my current mashine and definitely will keep it running for new 2990wx build.

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2018-09-17, 12:23:27
Reply #90

Juraj Talcik

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That sounds rather touchy.  Would you get that board again?

Sadly I would, I do not see the results of the other boards come even close.
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2018-09-17, 15:15:25
Reply #91

psanitra

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i just leave this here , 2019 AMD EPIC 64 core, 12k Cinebench score

https://www.hexus.net/tech/news/cpu/122222-amd-7nm-64c128t-epyc-benchmark-leaks/
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2018-09-17, 15:30:16
Reply #92

Juraj Talcik

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Looks pretty nice :- ).

Just received DHL info that Cyberport is sending me another MSI x399 the one I originally ordered one month ago, that they delived B350 instead and I asked for refund by letter, email, everything...
Last time I am ordering from Germany, the communication barrier is way too strong...
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2018-09-18, 20:57:34
Reply #93

burnin

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Good & valuable info about Windows slow down...

"Threadripper 2990WX Performance Regressions? Not so fast..." (Level1Techs@YouTube)

2018-09-19, 21:12:43
Reply #94

Radim Razzak

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i just leave this here , 2019 AMD EPIC 64 core, 12k Cinebench score

https://www.hexus.net/tech/news/cpu/122222-amd-7nm-64c128t-epyc-benchmark-leaks/

For those speaking czech there is an article which explains why this is most likely to be a fake...

https://www.cnews.cz/amd-7nm-procesory-zen2-epyc-ryzen-3000-cas-vydani

2018-09-21, 11:50:30
Reply #95

vansan

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So what you guys think about Noctua NH U14S TR4 with addional fan?
Is it enough for 2990wx to work without throttling, or better wait for more powerful air cooler?

2018-09-21, 11:57:08
Reply #96

Juraj Talcik

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I probably suggest against doing it. I know how my i9 7980XE had to keep full spin (1500rpms) of dual fans on much bigger NH-D15.

Is there still no review of the other one ?
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2018-09-21, 13:26:59
Reply #97

vansan

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I probably suggest against doing it. I know how my i9 7980XE had to keep full spin (1500rpms) of dual fans on much bigger NH-D15.

Is there still no review of the other one ?
I'd buy Silver Arrow TR4, if it ever exist, can't find it anywhere.
By the way, Juraj, what reliable AIO water cooler would you suggest?
I'm not going to overclock cpu.

2018-09-21, 13:43:24
Reply #98

Juraj Talcik

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It's not like you can choose, there is exactly one AIO available, in two revisions :- ).

Enermax LiqTech 360 II. According to Enermax rep I spoke to, even the I version should have addressed issue but there is no way of knowing what rev you are buying, so buying second version is the only safe bet.
Let's presume it's now without catastrophic faults :- ).

If you go this way, I highly suggest swapping the fans for latest Noctua A12. Sadly these are not available in black (F12 is) but they are super powerful/silent.

EDIT:

OK, looks like there is now also this. https://www.anandtech.com/show/13385/asus-unveils-rog-ryujin-aio-lcses-for-amds-cpus

Comes with Industrial version of Noctua F12. Not a bad deal.
« Last Edit: 2018-09-21, 19:31:17 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-09-23, 12:47:03
Reply #99

Juraj Talcik

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OK, as of right now, I can't suggest MSI MEG x399 AT ALL. And I am not sure I can suggest buying 2990WX until there is better board out there.

There is zero bios support. Last public one was 6 weeks ago ! I have big troubles with repeated boot into microcache loading with no apparent solution.

Fun fact: The recent Windows update came with microcode (yup, the same one in July) and capped the turbos severly from 4.0Ghz to 3.5Ghz. Uninstalling the patch and deleting mcupdate dlls (shitty procedure as you need to disable trustedinstaller in Win10) did not return anything. Manually forcing higher turbos (OC) in uefi only causes another mysterious boot issue, C5. Yup, there is no such thing as C5 Q-code in manual as of now.

You guys have no idea how disappointed I am in this. I've no idea what to actually do. Should I replace the board with some basic stuff like Taichi until x499 is here after winter ? Is x499 even coming ? Or wait who knows how long until MSI bothers to actually publish new uefi fix.
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2018-09-23, 18:28:22
Reply #100

Juraj Talcik

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I was given beta bios. It seemingly fixed my issues for now. I don't want to say it prematurely though...

Anyway, do not buy stuff which needs private beta bios for sakes.
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2018-09-23, 20:12:33
Reply #101

burnin

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 Building - TR 2990WX Programmers Workstation: Linus Torvalds' Edition (sort of)! (Level1Techs)
Assuming you wish to have 24/7 operating machine without hiccups for the next couple of years.
Headache free ;)

2018-09-23, 20:22:37
Reply #102

Juraj Talcik

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Building - TR 2990WX Programmers Workstation: Linus Torvalds' Edition (sort of)! (Level1Techs)
Assuming you wish to have 24/7 operating machine without hiccups for the next couple of years.
Headache free ;)


Are you trying to be funny or what ? I fail to see the sarcasm.
 Read his description:


Quote
Far as we know The TX4 bios is otherwise not available anywhere else. The fixes here will be integrated with the updated AGESA in just a few weeks, hopefully!


So he is using private beta bios as well to even get it working. Look up the Aorus Extreme review on previous page to see what "headache free" machine it makes for.

And good luck with 24/7 for years with the Enermax AIO...
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2018-09-23, 20:47:45
Reply #103

danio1011

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I was given beta bios. It seemingly fixed my issues for now. I don't want to say it prematurely though...

Anyway, do not buy stuff which needs private beta bios for sakes.

That’s insane and super frustrating for sure.  I’m waiting on the sidelines hoping a clear solution emerges.

I guess what’s unclear to me is the quantifiable difference if you were to go with a Taichi.  How much less of an ovecock could you get?  4.0 vs 4.1?  And do people ever watercool their VRMs with an aftermarket waterblock?

Anyway, too bad the MEG has been so frustrating!  And yeah...never again will I buy Enermax.  I’m thinking my 2990 build will be custom water.  I had good luck with that a few years back.

2018-09-24, 09:40:52
Reply #104

Juraj Talcik

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It's definitely not 4.0 vs 4.1. Both are only imho reachable by MEG & Zenith to be fully stable under actual load, and Zenith only with heavy air cooling towards VRM.

Water cooling VRM heatsink isn't that effective actually as the issue with them being overload stands. The tests on previous page (done in open bench) show big discrepancy between heatsink and the core temps. Even with fans blowing, they approach 120C a point where it starts to be shaky.

But I don't think that's issue, it's more than powerful if you settle somewhere between 3.6/3.7 @ 350W +/- and with good airflow can keep VRM passive again. And I don't know, but last thing I would want is 4cm fan spinning inside the case :- ).


Btw, the water loop is so silent (it's inaudible) that this is first time I only hear the PSU..and its rattling industrial fan kind of throws me off :- ). Maybe Seasonic should stop using the fluid bearings.
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2018-09-24, 10:45:31
Reply #105

psanitra

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Hey Juraj,  seems like this 2990wx build we do is more bleeding edge then we expected :/ , I still did not assembled my, i`m missing the case. I was going for evolv x, but i ditched it yesterday lol,  and ordered Lian o11- Air from caseking,  in favor of better positioning of 2 x 360 rads and additional 6x120fans for better airflow(GPUS + aorus VRMs). GA updated bios for Aorus extreme few days back,  hopefully with some of the stuff Wendel mentioned, agesa, governor, voltages, bios oc stuff...

Looks like i`m going to need full week holiday to get this build up and running..
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2018-09-24, 11:13:43
Reply #106

vansan

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I really appriciate you guys for sharing both positive and negative experience with your builds.
Also very interested in your experience of organising incase airflow.
To get more cool air inside I chose FRACTAL DESIGN Define S case, to move all hdd's to back side of the case.
My build with asrock taichi is still on paper, waiting for my order in first dayz of october.
Still no desition on cooler, hopefully new asus AIO's will arrive in shops soon, as they cool VRM's too.

2018-09-24, 11:54:47
Reply #107

Juraj Talcik

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Some pics.

The total airflow is as follow: Frontal 360mm tall 60mm thick Rad is in intake push-pull with 6x 120mm Noctua F12 PWM running between 200rpm (idle) to 600rpm while rendering. Top radiator is 420mm tall 45mm thick with 3x 140mm Noctua A14 PWM running between 200rpm (idle) to 600rpm while rendering.

For air-flow bottom case are 2x 120mm Noctua S12 PWM running 400rpm (idle) to 600rpm (rendering). Rear exhaust is 140mm Noctua A14 PWM running 400rpm idle to 600rpm while rendering.


The setup is positive-heavy due to case being open, so to avoid dust buildup. Same reason for pull-only top radiator, it's easier to clean and doesn't obstruct the board for easy service/replacement.
(bottom fans are not installed in this pics, I was still waiting for them. Rad fans might need 800rpm for overclock but due to waiting for stable bios, it's not necessary at this time. Even at 400rpm, the CPU cores are 56C while rendering at stock.)
(if you find the bottom tube awkward, know that is for easy adding for GPU later. Less hassle, no need to add tubing).

Why the strange case :- ) ? It's the biggest one that would still fit under the table to allow for two thick rad without obstructing the tall VRM heatsink on MEG. It can house 2x 60mm 360mm rads easily (or even thicker front!).
It's not minimalistic but the glass is actually almost full-black, not see-through. I just post-produced the photos to better show internal :- ). In life it's ok to look at, almost enjoyable in fact.









No RGB was seen :- ). Although I did take one pic of it heh.
« Last Edit: 2018-09-24, 12:44:19 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-09-24, 12:22:23
Reply #108

psanitra

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Juraj, how did you setup your fans cables + control?  3 to 1 Y splitter and then dirrectly to board , and each rad separately for more control? or both rads are on one PWM control cable to cpu FAN?  i`m going to have 12 fans in my, maybe in need to look for some fan hub..
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2018-09-24, 12:25:56
Reply #109

Juraj Talcik

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Hey Juraj,  seems like this 2990wx build we do is more bleeding edge then we expected :/ , I still did not assembled my, i`m missing the case. I was going for evolv x, but i ditched it yesterday lol,  and ordered Lian o11- Air from caseking,  in favor of better positioning of 2 x 360 rads and additional 6x120fans for better airflow(GPUS + aorus VRMs). GA updated bios for Aorus extreme few days back,  hopefully with some of the stuff Wendel mentioned, agesa, governor, voltages, bios oc stuff...

Looks like i`m going to need full week holiday to get this build up and running..


That's pretty smart case ! I did not even consider these wide cases to get around the table height limitation. This one seems to do it right by being one&half thick and not the oppressively looking double-wide cases.

Interesting fact is that after putting the PC together, I installed new bios (one six week old from August, but still newer than 10 week old from July the board shipped from) which had exactly one thing, the AGESA update. That did not help sadly my case, but the recent beta bios (one week old) seems to fixed everything for now.


Juraj, how did you setup your fans cables + control?  3 to 1 Y splitter and then dirrectly to board , and each rad separately for more control? or both rads are on one PWM control cable to cpu FAN?  i`m going to have 12 fans in my, maybe in need to look for some fan hub..


I went with big splitters connected directly to PSU as MOLEX (since board limitations basically allow only 3to1) and only PWM controllers attached to board.
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2018-09-24, 14:46:32
Reply #110

vansan

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Juraj, thank you!
I really miss youtube video, where the process of assebling workstation like yours is recorded.
It's beautiful!

2018-09-24, 14:51:42
Reply #111

Juraj Talcik

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I am way too awkward to make a youtube video, and I was too busy to record everything properly but I did few timelapses where I build it with my friend Martin. Maybe I'll find some time to stitch it together :- )
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2018-09-24, 20:33:52
Reply #112

burnin

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Are you trying to be funny or what ? I fail to see the sarcasm.
I see, i expressed myself poorly. No sarcasm, but thankful for all your efforts to save us from 'headaches'.
I sincerely apologize.

BTW. Great setup. Keep it up.

2018-09-25, 06:30:54
Reply #113

spadestick

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Any thoughts on the new RTX Turing Architecture?

2018-09-26, 07:55:05
Reply #114

Luke

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@juraj how does it run? is it everything you hoped for?

can you summarise/list the components in one easy to read post? I've trawled this thread and tbh get quite lost in the tech talk...
« Last Edit: 2018-09-26, 09:18:04 by Luke »

2018-09-26, 11:28:45
Reply #115

Juraj Talcik

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Yes I plan to do, was just too busy. Easy to post tidbits between nervous breakdown for 6k machine functioning as expected :- ).
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2018-09-26, 13:18:39
Reply #116

Zray

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Yes I plan to do, was just too busy. Easy to post tidbits between nervous breakdown for 6k machine functioning as expected :- ).
hi, what is your msi pci card?

2018-09-26, 13:42:25
Reply #117

Juraj Talcik

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Yes I plan to do, was just too busy. Easy to post tidbits between nervous breakdown for 6k machine functioning as expected :- ).
hi, what is your msi pci card?

It's bundled PCIe expander card with four m.2 slots for PCIe SSDs. It's big overkill in terms of cooling :- ) But since there is empty space there why not.
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2018-09-28, 13:22:53
Reply #118

psanitra

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For everybody that is tempted to go for Enermax liqtech tr4 AIO

Just don`t do it, TR II have leaking issues as well....

here are few posts from official US Enermax support:

https://hardforum.com/threads/enermax-liqtech-tr4-aio-liquid-cpu-coolers-review.1945204/page-4#post-1043848370
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2018-09-28, 14:28:48
Reply #119

Juraj Talcik

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Oh wow, well that seals the deal for AIOs.
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2018-10-01, 09:19:37
Reply #120

Zray

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Yes I plan to do, was just too busy. Easy to post tidbits between nervous breakdown for 6k machine functioning as expected :- ).
hi, what is your msi pci card?

It's bundled PCIe expander card with four m.2 slots for PCIe SSDs. It's big overkill in terms of cooling :- ) But since there is empty space there why not.
Thanks. Does your computer work well now? I am waiting 2970x :)

2018-10-01, 13:52:20
Reply #121

Juraj Talcik

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It seemingly seems so :- ).

Except latest Corona daily (couldn't test normal build) only uses 30perc. computing power during UHD Cache phase compared to i9. Not sure what to make of that..
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2018-10-01, 15:22:46
Reply #122

Fluss

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Except latest Corona daily (couldn't test normal build) only uses 30perc. computing power during UHD Cache phase compared to i9. Not sure what to make of that..

It behaves the same way here on dual xeon 2696 v4. Not sure it is related to the amd chip
« Last Edit: 2018-10-01, 15:30:22 by Fluss »

2018-10-01, 15:40:16
Reply #123

Juraj Talcik

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Yeah I am not sure either, just throwing that out. I have the same daily build on my i9 7980XE and that one uses 100perc. and thus computes the UHD much faster (yes we're talking 2 vs 4 seconds but still ;- )
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2018-10-03, 05:15:41
Reply #124

Gewiz90

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Would you recommend it?

2018-10-03, 13:07:36
Reply #125

Juraj Talcik

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The 2990WX ? Yes, there isn't anything better on market and you shouldn't expect the 28C Intel any soon (22C is coming to market only in near future, and it will have same performance as the 18 core as what you get with more cores Intel will eat in heat reducing its overclocking potential. They are all just rebranded xeons, no way to go around the physics).

Is it living up to its full potential ? No, but we knew that but it's still very fast where it matters. But I will continue to wonder if there isn't some way for Corona to optimize the usage of Threadripper or AMD in general as platform. It has better performance in other renderers (even Vray).
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2018-10-03, 17:53:56
Reply #126

psanitra

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ok, all components ready, lets do this :)

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2018-10-03, 17:59:00
Reply #127

Juraj Talcik

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I know what I forgot to write you... 1L of fluid wasn't enough for the loop in my case (it ended up being 1.5 I think) I would suggest to order another concentrate just in case.
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2018-10-04, 02:24:25
Reply #128

lupaz

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A side question:
How many times faster would you say 2990WX is compared to ryzen 7 1800x with corona?

2018-10-05, 00:11:22
Reply #129

psanitra

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Getting some stuff in.  Front and bottom fans next.

due manufacturing precision EK vs Lian li, i was not able to one last crew on side radiator fan, holes does not align.

I was a bit disappointing that EKs Vardar fans does not come with any rubber feet or other vibration dampening system.

i kept one of the NVME drives under original Aorus heasink, and for second slot i used EKs heatsink. I wonder what`s the temperature difference going to be..

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2018-10-05, 11:49:36
Reply #130

Juraj Talcik

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That's totally fine, I didn't order enough long screws so three of my fans are mounted only by two opposing screws :- ). Thankfully though even the Chromax Noctuas do have anti-vibration parts in package.
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2018-10-05, 21:37:16
Reply #131

Juraj Talcik

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https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-cpu-threadripper-2970wx-2920x,37895.html

Quote
including a new Dynamic Local Mode that automatically migrates applications to CPU cores with direct memory access.

Yay, let's see how this will work.
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2018-10-05, 22:43:14
Reply #132

psanitra

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https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-cpu-threadripper-2970wx-2920x,37895.html

Quote
including a new Dynamic Local Mode that automatically migrates applications to CPU cores with direct memory access.

Yay, let's see how this will work.

That looks promising!
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2018-10-06, 13:37:20
Reply #133

fraine7

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For anyone using the 2990WX (Juraj), are you experiencing any system stability issues?

If I begin to render, I get to about 10 mins in and my screens are going completely black, power buttons on the case do not respond and the system needs a hard reset via the PSU switch on the back of my case. Motherboard displays a red LED which reads 'CPU' - This appears to have been an issue with the 1st gen Ryzen chips but I'm not having any luck finding the solution.

Latest bios installed, chipset drivers direct from AMD, all other drivers up to date and Windows 10 fully up to date too.

Obvious next steps include taking the CPU and/or motherboard back to the supplier but this doesn't guarantee that my problem will disappear, it might just reappear with the replacement parts.

Any issues with your system?

2018-10-06, 13:41:50
Reply #134

Juraj Talcik

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No, absolutely no issues since I updated to 1.25 for the MEG board. Perfectly stable rendering 24/7. I've only set PBO to 350W though for CPU, will give it back to 500-600W with another revision of bios, right now I am bit scared of it. Although running benchmarks at 500W (3.95-4.05Ghz all-core) no stability issues were observed either.

What board do you have ? What PSU, are you monitoring all temperatures with HWinfo (esp. VRM) ?
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2018-10-06, 14:00:27
Reply #135

fraine7

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Full specs for the Threadripper build:

CPU - 2990WX
GPU - Nvidia GTX1080Ti
MOBO - MSI X399 Sli-Plus (MS 7B09)
RAM - Corsair Vengeance CMU64GX4M4A2666C16 (64GB)
PSU - EVGA 1000 Watt GQ Gold Hybrid Modular
HD -  Samsung SSD 970 EVO 500GB (NvME)
Cooler - Thermaltake Riing 3.0 240mm AIO

Temps never really exceed 65c, monitored with CPUID HWmonitor

I haven't touched PBO (only just searched it online to see what it was) Is this something I should be looking to change?

Thanks
« Last Edit: 2018-10-06, 14:04:09 by fraine7 »

2018-10-06, 14:11:50
Reply #136

Juraj Talcik

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It looks in order, except for the cooler. Are you sure none of the cores exceeds 65 ? Your AIO cpu block doesn't cover the heatspreader, it definitely isn't 2990WX compatible cooler.

But I am not saying that is it.
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2018-10-06, 14:19:23
Reply #137

fraine7

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It may reach 67c on occasion but honestly the cooler seems to be doing a good job, even considering the lack of full coverage.

I am just looking at the PBO options in bios, if I set it to manual I was expecting to see some options for specifying a number but it doesn’t give me any. Do I set this number in the Ryzen master tool once enabled in Bios. I don’t actually know what this is or what it does to be perfectly honest.

Thanks

2018-10-06, 14:36:12
Reply #138

fraine7

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PPT, TDC and EDC are all maxed out at 250, 215 and 300 respectively. I’m in creator mode and these are the limits, I’m unable to type in a higher number - how did you get it to 350w?

2018-10-06, 14:42:28
Reply #139

Juraj Talcik

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I don't know if individual boards support different limits. In manual PBO mode in bios, I can specify anything and the MSI MEG limit is 700W. I didn't try Ryzen Master yet, it probably is helpful when trying different setups but ultimately it's better to set it up from boot.
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2018-10-06, 15:21:32
Reply #140

fraine7

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Apparently bios is the only way to do this, Ryzen Master is pretty useless to be honest, all values are capped at AMD’s recommendations (250w max for PPT)

My main concern is why I should be needing to change any of this stuff when all I am trying to do is use the chip at stock speeds to render. I haven’t even looked at overclocking as the stability is non-existent at 3ghz.

The lack of knowledge from my retailer regarding this chip and the x399 system is pretty frustrating, I might have to return both the cpu and motherboard and replace them with intel components but that would be a big performance loss and probably cost the same.

2018-10-06, 16:07:59
Reply #141

Juraj Talcik

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You shouldn't need to touch it at all. PBO is AMD's way of overclocking by simply unlocking the power limits. 250W is the upper limit of what 2990WX will require at stock. It would not be very stable without serious air flow to cool down the limited VRM phases of your board.


Can you check if both 12V leads (in upper left corner) are connected from PSU ? Just to rule out your system not getting enough juice.
Is your system stable if you run your memory at default clock without AXMP profile (AMXP OFF)?


MSI has very shit default bios settings. Make sure their GamingMode/OC Genie/etc..(it's called differently in every board) is turned SW(Software) and 0 (Turned OFF). It's in upper left corner in bios.
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2018-10-06, 16:27:00
Reply #142

fraine7

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Both CPU 12v leads are plugged in. System is absolutely fine until rendering, I could be using Photoshop or After Effects etc all day without issue but when I try set my animation off rendering it begins to cause instability, I have to manually switch off the psu as nothing else responds.

XMP has been disabled since the day I installed everything, I was hoping to enable it once everything seemed stable but I haven’t reached that point yet.

I’ve disabled the OC genie stuff too, and just as an extra step I’ve switched the physical switch to 0 on my mobo as well, although it is currently in SW (bios) mode.

Windows isn’t reading any errors or giving much useful info out in the reliability manager or event logs.

I’m thinking it’s a bad motherboard but could just as well be CPU.

A few years ago I had issues with the Asus Suite III and my old 5960x, the asus utility was trying to do things which Windows wasn't allowing (permissions etc) and it caused BSOD many times. I thought maybe this was a similar issue but even after uninstalling any kind of AMD utility the problem persists.
« Last Edit: 2018-10-06, 16:31:07 by fraine7 »

2018-10-06, 16:48:10
Reply #143

fraine7

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Currently running a stability test through Aida64.

CPU temp has not yet exceeded 68c at 100% load, 10 mins in and it is fixed at this value which suggests to me that the cooler is doing its job well enough.

Max power so far is 235w, this reaches 250w when rendering which could be an indicator of what is happening with the system hang/freeze/lockup etc. Could it be that the CPU is demanding more power but is being prevented from getting it by the bios settings, through which I am unable to exceed 250w.

Surely this can't be a Max/Corona issue, all the other stress tests I put this machine through suggest the build is super-stable but rendering is completely out of the question it seems.

Other thoughts I've considered, when rendering my animation, the CPU will obviously be at 100% when rendering but will then drop substantially whilst calculating geometry/scene parsing. Could there be an issue with the CPU picking itself up once the cores have relaxed for a moment?

2018-10-06, 17:00:39
Reply #144

Juraj Talcik

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But how is the temperature spread ? The cooler doesn't cover all of those four dies well so the cores on the outside can get disproportionally hotter. It's not unusual to get difference of 20C between different cores. That is basically the deal with my i9 which has small heatspreader, but the difference can be even bigger with the massive heatspreader of TR4.

I would run Prime95 which has AVX, it better simulates Corona's load.


Could there be an issue with the CPU picking itself up once the cores have relaxed for a moment?

The spike ? I doubt that. I do find Corona's pre-rendering to be poorly using CPU's performance though and this is even worse for some reason on Threadripper. Like I mentioned above, I only get 30perc. usage during UHD calculations.
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2018-10-06, 17:03:14
Reply #145

fraine7

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I will give Prime95 a run now, thanks.

I've attached the Aida64 test result in case there's anything which catches your eye - it was only a 20 minute test but this exceeds the amount of time I can render for without issue.

2018-10-06, 17:23:45
Reply #146

fraine7

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It seems neither Aida64 or Prime95 (currently still running) will push things to the 250w limit (see attached) - it only seems to go 90% of the way there, around 237w.

Corona seems to push this up to 250w immediately, I have not been able to crash the system running any stress test so far, not once.

Really confused as to what might be causing the rendering issues, I am currently on a 3.0 daily build and will revert back to 2.0 for further testing but I can't see that being the cause - worth a check though whilst I'm scratching my head for other ideas.

Thanks for your input so far Juraj, really appreciate it ;)

2018-10-06, 17:32:18
Reply #147

Juraj Talcik

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Hmm, I really don't know. So Corona does shoot to 250W, but that itself doesn't crash it if I understand, it's only after certain while (10 +/- minutes) when it does ? That would rule out power limits and point more towards cooling.

I can feel the frustration, when I've setup our 2990WX which we really needed at the time and it didn't even work with the public bios I was close to insanity. Every wasted day counted, 5k euro spent and shit is not working. If the private beta bios didn't solve my issues I was prepared to start with parts swap (first motherboard).


Hope this will be solved for you. One more try, maybe contact them through website ticket as well, there might be beta bios likewise.
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2018-10-06, 17:47:01
Reply #148

fraine7

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I think that's the next logical step, contacting AMD and seeking their advice.

My retailer who I get all my parts from are happy to run Aida64 and Prime95 tests on the chip but as I've already done those many times I don't think I would gain anything. They're not going to render my animation for me and keep an eye on it whilst it fails, would be useful if they did but this could well happen with another 2990wx if they were to replace it.

I'll let you know how I get on in case it helps with other Corona users looking to build a 2nd gen Ryzen machine!

2018-10-06, 17:51:17
Reply #149

Juraj Talcik

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I would strongly suggest for builders of 2990WX to stick to one of the two only boards designed to support it from the ground, MSI MEG and Aorus Xtreme. These are still imperfect and with poor bios, but they still stand out among the others.

I wonder if (and if it's actually coming in January, at least the reveal) X599 will change this.
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2018-10-06, 18:03:03
Reply #150

fraine7

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Forgot to ask what cooler you are running on the 2990WX? I can order one and see if it has any effect, if not I can always send it back within 14 days

2018-10-06, 18:12:18
Reply #151

Juraj Talcik

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My build is on page 8, it's custom water loop.

There isn't much choice right now:

-Single available AIO is Thermaltake Liqtech 360 II, but as you can read two pages ago, even this most recent iteration is having leaking issues. Big nope.
-Some upcoming AIOs like Coolermaster and Asus have full coverage of heatspreader...but this is bit false alarm. This is just additional copper plate on top of the same asetec above. It's better...but not as good.

So outside of custom water loop, Air coolers are actually the more sensible choice.

-Noctua UH14 TR4. At stock settings, would be ok. Potential 320W rate (at high RPMs).
-Silver Arrow TR4. Looks like it's finally here, has more heatpipes than Noctua and is considerably larger. A true alternative to non-existing NH-D15. Except no reviews... outside of two crappy youtube ones. Here is one:

https://geizhals.eu/thermalright-silver-arrow-tr4-100700418-a1848365.html?t=alle&plz=&va=b&vl=de&hloc=at&hloc=de&hloc=pl&hloc=uk&hloc=eu&v=l


And well that's it, nothing else.
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2018-10-06, 18:15:28
Reply #152

fraine7

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Very useful info, thanks so much!

Just ordered a Noctua UH14, I will look into custom loops at some point, once this animation is out of the way I have hundreds more images to get through so I just need something stable for now.

Huge thanks for your help so far!

2018-10-06, 19:41:30
Reply #153

fraine7

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So I can render a still image for hours, no issues at all!

5 frames into an animation, complete system failure - I’m clueless as to what is going on

2018-10-06, 22:07:17
Reply #154

fraine7

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Me again ;)

So I found a Reddit thread which discusses a 68c temp limit for the 2990WX - had no idea this existed before building this machine
(https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/9gidma/amd_precision_boost_overdrive_pbo_ramblings/)

As my CPU was hitting this AMD specified limit, the chip was failing and the motherboard had stopped communicating with it completely, I'm guessing some kind of fail-safe in the 2990WX causes this but it is not publicised anywhere and has driven me crazy for weeks!

I have now disabled every possible option for running this chip above the 3ghz base-clock, it has an auto feature which takes it up to the 250w limit but the temperature limit counteracts this and causes system failure.

Max wattage for the CPU is now capped at around 215w (250w limit) and the benefit is that my temperatures have yet to exceed 60c - and guess what, my animation is chugging along nicely.

Don't let any of these issues put you off building a machine with this chip - when it works it really is unbeatable value for money. Just be aware that there are a ton of built-in functions which try to push this chip to increase speeds, but then those same built-in functions have to fight against the temperature limit of this massive chip, and that's where the failures begin to happen.

Unless I can work out how to A) increase my total wattage allowed to be used by the CPU above 250w, and B) keep my temperatures below 68c (apparently this isn't currently possible due to AMD's own overprotective restraints) then I will have to use this chip at it's lowest and slowest speed of 3ghz.

So happy I can now leave the room and let my animation fly knowing I won't come back to black screens and an unresponsive box of heat!

PS - also had to lower RAM speeds from 2666mhz to 2133mhz - again resulting in slower rendering but at least it works

2018-10-06, 23:36:17
Reply #155

Juraj Talcik

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I didn't know of this, hmm, surprising. Nonetheless, it should throttle, not crash.

To fully bypass PBO you can set fixed multiplier. But unless you fix it to 4.0 Ghz for which you require very solid cooling, you will loose single-thread performance as I didn't see option to set multiplier for different amount of cores (like I can do for my i9 with Asus uefi).

I think we moved into territory where top HEDT chips like 2990WX, i9 7980XE,etc. will simply require lot of juice (lot of VRM phases) and cooling. This is one place where these builds sort of fail compared to dual-cpu server type of workstations. Now Threadripper is actually very solid in terms of TDP, the 250W is actually 250W, my i9 stock is 280+ W (so much for claimed 165W, which only goes for base clocks that never actually apply).

The upcoming Z399 Intels (22c and maybe the mythological 28C ? But I doubt the latter) will be even worse. Regular cooling need not apply..
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2018-10-06, 23:44:51
Reply #156

fraine7

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Good to know.

Lowering my clock speeds has allowed the system to stabilise and I can only think that the turbo features built in to the bios were pushing too hard. A throttle as opposed to a complete failure would have been fine, I would have been happy with that.

Could it be that my ram voltages were being pushed too high and causing the failure? The motherboard was displaying a red LED indicating CPU error but if the ram had failed then the CPU would naturally become unresponsive and force the motherboard to illuminate the LED.

I really don’t know enough about all the under the hood tuning features but it’s rendering now and until my knowledge is substantial enough to start playing around I’ll have to leave things as they are.

2018-10-08, 11:12:12
Reply #157

vansan

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Finally my CPU arrived, built my rig and now I have statistics from 2 workstations with similar hardware:
AMD 2990wx, Asrock X399 Taichi, NZXT Kraken X72, 4x16 DDR4 2933 ram modules, Fractal Design Define S case.

No overclocking, CPU temperature is 62-64 on rendering, clocks 3.2-3.3 GHz, all stable.

2018-10-08, 11:56:20
Reply #158

Juraj Talcik

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Happy rendering, hope the shit works :- ).
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2018-10-08, 16:18:40
Reply #159

Vuk

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Really sad to hear some people are still having problem with the 2990WX but I guess all will be ironed in the next few weeks, maybe months. Seems that the TR 2 launch has the same bad start as Ryzen when it was first introduced.
Juraj what time did you manage to get in corona render benchmark with the new machine?

2018-10-08, 17:48:39
Reply #160

Juraj Talcik

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Stock settings (+/- 3.3Ghz) = 39 seconds, PBO auto (+/- 450W @3.95Ghz = 36 seconds). Manual PBO (500W @3.95- 4.05) also...36 seconds.

It does not scale that well. Because I have overkill cooling (1400W heh, the fans don't even need to spin at full overclock) I believe I can successfully ignore PBO and set the multiplier for x42 and get maybe 33 seconds (I did not set it this way because it's running on Beta bios and I need this PC to be super stable right now) But what is funny is that by this, it has close to 6200 CB15 score, super close to top platinum xeons, but those will reach easily into twenties.
So Corona can't utilize Threadripper as well. Some things to consider is that the benchmark isn't linear, it still have considerable pre-render phase and right now my 2990WX only runs by 30perc. during them, slowing stuff like UHD,etc..

So it's really good, but it's not great. It scales extremely well in some other "benchmarks" I run, namely Marvelous Designer and PTGui 360 stitching. I did not have time to run Vray. We're in super busy work phase, I had to set it up and immidiatelly get it to work for Veronik.

I would still suggest it 100perc. It's much more affordable even compared to OEM/ES 8173M/8180M at their best ebay price, and absolutely superior in single threaded operations which I believe will only improve with the upcoming dynamic mode (automatic process lasso/scheduling in Ryzen master utility). But there is some wasted potential and I can only wonder if it's due to memory (plausible, since 2133 vs 2933 yielded drastic difference) or partly Corona's architecture.

(I believe the dynamic mode would alleviate the issues with Corona's prerender phase as I believe this is where memory bandwidth becomes issue. This set of processes are not multithreading well from start to finish so as long as they will be ofshored to cores with direct memory access, perhaps it can shave some time on benchmark. It will not have any impact on longer rendering time).
« Last Edit: 2018-10-08, 17:53:11 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-10-08, 19:17:58
Reply #161

danio1011

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Hi Juraj - Just as another datapoint, my threadripper 1950X (OC'ed to 3.88ghz) hits 93% usage during the first few seconds of UHD Cache and then drops to 80-82% for the remainder.  For displacement it's lower....50-60%.  30% is pretty low but maybe it's the ratio of processing power to RAM changing how perceptible the bottleneck is?

Cheers,
Daniel

2018-10-08, 19:31:06
Reply #162

Juraj Talcik

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I wish I would know what's behind it. In practical terms, it's difference of 2 seconds versus 3 seconds (i9 7980XE vs 2990WX), but it can potentially hinder interactive performance. Surely doesn't feel that way but still.
We're talking daily builds so maybe it's tied to it but I don't have time to try regular build.

It reminds me how parsing on nodes (2698v4 Xeons) during Distributed rendering is much slower than when run directly from 3dsMax and it mostly seems because it barely uses available performance in multithreaded fashion.
The whole precomp phase is bottleneck, but more so on Threadripper than i9.
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2018-10-09, 02:24:03
Reply #163

astrofalcon

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https://goo.gl/DPdd5x

I have the new threadripper 2 32 core and it's been great does run a little hot but nothing that can't be tamed with a good cooler.

- Shawn

2018-10-09, 04:54:48
Reply #164

arqrenderz

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We need a new benchmark scene, we need to run it for at least 5-10 minutes and have a # of passes as the end result.

2018-10-09, 06:23:16
Reply #165

danio1011

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I wish I would know what's behind it. In practical terms, it's difference of 2 seconds versus 3 seconds (i9 7980XE vs 2990WX), but it can potentially hinder interactive performance. Surely doesn't feel that way but still.
We're talking daily builds so maybe it's tied to it but I don't have time to try regular build.

It reminds me how parsing on nodes (2698v4 Xeons) during Distributed rendering is much slower than when run directly from 3dsMax and it mostly seems because it barely uses available performance in multithreaded fashion.
The whole precomp phase is bottleneck, but more so on Threadripper than i9.

I bet you're right, that it's the RAM bottleneck.  That's why the bottleneck is ~2x as bad with 2x as many cores (1950x vs 2990wx).  Although the weird thing is I wouldn't think of UHD Cache as being memory intensive.  Displacement I could understand.  But this is just me rambling about things that I don't really have a grasp of.

2018-10-09, 10:24:17
Reply #166

Juraj Talcik

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Will do another set of benchmarks in one or two months when : Dynamic mode will come to Ryzen master, Stable public bios available for MSI MEG, current poor Windows updates stabilize, with public version of Corona v3. Will do it at fixed x42 multiplier.
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2018-10-09, 10:30:00
Reply #167

Juraj Talcik

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Damn MSI, now that they learned how to actually design proper HEDT board with their alpha version AMD version, they come up with much improved Intel's counterpart.

Look how MSI MEG looks for x299 platform: Phases aren't in single long row, thus space for 4 dual-slot GPUs suddenly became available even for EATX without going EEB (yes the CPU socket size makes for difference too, but this could be designed around).
Dual 8-pin becomes tripple 8-pin, testament to how actually powerhungry the LGA2066 chips are.

I think i'll buy this to my i9 7980XE so it's more solid overclocker.

https://www.guru3d.com/news-story/msi-announces-x299-meg-creation.html
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2018-10-09, 12:45:31
Reply #168

psanitra

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Damn MSI, now that they learned how to actually design proper HEDT board with their alpha version AMD version, they come up with much improved Intel's counterpart.

Look how MSI MEG looks for x299 platform: Phases aren't in single long row, thus space for 4 dual-slot GPUs suddenly became available even for EATX without going EEB (yes the CPU socket size makes for difference too, but this could be designed around).
Dual 8-pin becomes tripple 8-pin, testament to how actually powerhungry the LGA2066 chips are.

I think i'll buy this to my i9 7980XE so it's more solid overclocker.

https://www.guru3d.com/news-story/msi-announces-x299-meg-creation.html

nice board indeed, and properly spreaded 4 PCI slots :)

I just started to run my leak tests.... I really like the cable management on 0-11 Air, all hidden in the back, and i can even throw and extra fan on the mobo backplate:) I used few sleeved cables too, for PCIe and 24pin mobo  because original cables from 1600w psu were too rigid..
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2018-10-09, 15:16:04
Reply #169

Juraj Talcik

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I actually desperately tried to get few sleeved cables myself when I realized I almost can't bend properly the 24pin :- ).

Looks very good !!
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2018-10-10, 09:47:52
Reply #170

psanitra

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I`m up and running. All smooth. After 8h testing/rendering, not a single blue screen / crash.

Booted right away, updated bios, no issues.

All 8 G.Skill sticks work fine on factory XMP profile, 128GB  at 2933. kit is F4-2933C14Q2-128GTZRX , timing  14-14-14-34 .

Performance wise, tested multiple PBO configs from 250 to 500, and i settled on 400/400/400 for now. With that i get good single core performance boosts to 4.1-4.2Ghz, and for multicore I get 5750 in cinebench.  Aorus VRM at this settings, after 1h rendering never peaked above 100C.(with extra fan on the backplate of the mobo)

Asus Hyper m.2 x16 works perfect on x399 too, With 2x2TB Samsung EVO 970, i get 6800MB/s read, and 5000MB/s write.  Raid needs to be setup in BIOS, 16 PCI slot set to 4/4/4/4 and AMD raid driver installed at windows installation.

V-ray bench - 24 seconds
Corona Bench - 36 seconds

Only issue with EKWB vardar fans, from 9 of them, 2 suck, one ignores PWM(maybe broken cable), and other one is noisy af. But damm, that orange/red heat looks good on them :) will return and replace.

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2018-10-11, 14:24:17
Reply #171

Zray

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I`m up and running. All smooth. After 8h testing/rendering, not a single blue screen / crash.

Booted right away, updated bios, no issues.

All 8 G.Skill sticks work fine on factory XMP profile, 128GB  at 2933. kit is F4-2933C14Q2-128GTZRX , timing  14-14-14-34 .

Performance wise, tested multiple PBO configs from 250 to 500, and i settled on 400/400/400 for now. With that i get good single core performance boosts to 4.1-4.2Ghz, and for multicore I get 5750 in cinebench.  Aorus VRM at this settings, after 1h rendering never peaked above 100C.(with extra fan on the backplate of the mobo)

Asus Hyper m.2 x16 works perfect on x399 too, With 2x2TB Samsung EVO 970, i get 6800MB/s read, and 5000MB/s write.  Raid needs to be setup in BIOS, 16 PCI slot set to 4/4/4/4 and AMD raid driver installed at windows installation.

V-ray bench - 24 seconds
Corona Bench - 36 seconds

Only issue with EKWB vardar fans, from 9 of them, 2 suck, one ignores PWM(maybe broken cable), and other one is noisy af. But damm, that orange/red heat looks good on them :) will return and replace.


Great performance

2018-10-11, 21:23:19
Reply #172

psanitra

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I was doing some  more testing, and i found new sweet spot for my build. Running manual x 38 at 1.1 volt.

Scores 5870 in cinebench, eats only 290W max. That means i can run all fans on 30% speed, aka silence. 6h render run at this settings, stable, 56c max temp on CPU, and 92 on VRM.
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2018-10-22, 15:18:19
Reply #173

nerfherder

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So my MSI MEG Creation board died last week (I'm in the nightmare process of trying to get it RMA'd by MSI).In the meantime, I need to replace it with another, preferably non-MSI board. Can anyone here recommend one? I was originally trying to avoid using the gen 1 motherboards with the 2990wx, but at the moment I think I'll go with the ASUS Zenith Extreme, so looking for real-world use cases as oppose to a review that uses it for a day or 2.
Oh, and if anyone who has the MEG wants to try their luck with BIOS v26, I was sent it as part of their tech supports efforts to get the board working. Couldn't tell you what it fixes or breaks, but if anyone wants to try it then do ask.
Cheers

2018-10-23, 13:20:32
Reply #174

psanitra

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Sorry to hear that. What happen the the board btw? any indications?  Did you had it overclocked? I`m running Aorus Extreme, so far so good. Updated bios twice, all was fine, even Raid0 data stayed intact. Its ok board, but have it`s limits in VRM. I would not recommend overclocking it for 24/7 rendering use unless you can manage/mod the VRM cooling.  I`ve removed those "nice looking"  but useless plastic covers from VRM and i have 10 degree lower temps.  I added extra fan and got another 15 degrees lower temp. 25c difference that`s just crazy, and shows how stupid this LED/GAMING marketing is, creating rainbow looking board, rather then a functional one, just sad...

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2018-10-23, 15:10:25
Reply #175

nerfherder

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Something to do with the BIOS itself -  it was always slow to boot up, about 15 minutes sometimes (which I initially put down to drivers, new platform, bios, something I'd built wrong) suddenly would take about an hour to get to POST , and that's if it even got that far - sometimes it would just power cycle endlessly. When it was working I had overclocked it for a bit to 3.7/3.8, but I'd mainly settled on upping the power cap to 400W and letting AMDs PBO do it for me. Ryzen Master would limit the CPU temps to about 68c, and it was boosting to an average 3.6. Was going to do some tweaking to the fans to get the temps down more when the motherboard finally died.
Handling the VRMs was what drew me to the MSI. They would get to about 75/80c under load, which I think was ok. But the bios for the MSI was terrible (no custom fan curves!!).
Crazy that you got such a drop in VRM temps from a few simple modifications. Did you add the fan direct to the motherboard (I think that's what the ASUS has done for gen2), or just to your case? I think EKWB has a few monoblocks for ASUS and Gigabyte motherboards, but I'm not sure how well they perform at cooling the VRM.
Such a shame really, because I was loving the actual performance of the chip - don't be put off anyone from buying one, just be aware that there are a few teething problems out there!

2018-10-23, 16:23:00
Reply #176

agentdark45

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So my MSI MEG Creation board died last week (I'm in the nightmare process of trying to get it RMA'd by MSI).In the meantime, I need to replace it with another, preferably non-MSI board. Can anyone here recommend one? I was originally trying to avoid using the gen 1 motherboards with the 2990wx, but at the moment I think I'll go with the ASUS Zenith Extreme, so looking for real-world use cases as oppose to a review that uses it for a day or 2.
Oh, and if anyone who has the MEG wants to try their luck with BIOS v26, I was sent it as part of their tech supports efforts to get the board working. Couldn't tell you what it fixes or breaks, but if anyone wants to try it then do ask.
Cheers

The MEG board has been out of stock everywhere in the UK for months now so I ended up going with the Zenith Extreme. I'm getting my system built at OCUK and the overclocker 8Pack will be tuning my system. From his testing he recommended the Zenith board over the MEG for 24/7 rendering use at 3.9/4ghz despite the VRM limitations. I'll see how it goes and update you guys when I get the system. I'll also have an extra 120mm Noctua fan pointed at the VRM's (using a custom bracket), just for extra peace of mind.
Vray who?

2018-10-23, 18:15:43
Reply #177

jamesdowling

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Sorry to jump into this post, theres some great info on this thread so I thought it's the best place to get some help with my new 2990wx build. I built my last pc 5 years ago so im a bit out of the loop. any sugestions/improvements would be greatly appreciated!

so far I have spec'd.

CPU-Threadripper 2990WX

MB-MSI MEG X399 CREATION EATX TR4 (although I just read theres some problems?)

Ram - I have spent a week looking through charts and i'm more confused than when i started (samsung B-dies only?) I may also add another 64gb in the future.

Corsair - Vengeance LED (4 x 16GB) DDR4-3000 Memory (CMU64GX4M4C3000C15)
Corsair - Vengeance LPX 64GB (4 x 16GB) DDR4-2666 Memory (CMK64GX4M4A2666C16)
Or if theres any better options that anyone has in there builds? I was looking at the G.Skill Trident Z RGB but its almost twice the price and has rgb...

Cpu Cooler- such a bad selection available but I dont trust my abilities to make a custom loop.
The best option seems to be Thermalright silver arrow TR4, although theres no reviews...and I can only seem to find it on this website
https://www.sotel.de does anyone know if its a legit site?

or theres these options...

Cooler Master Wraith Ripper
Deepcool Fryzen
Noctua - NH-U14S TR4-SP3
Enermax - LIQTECH TR4 II 360 (so many bad reviews for build quality)

GPU- either a 1080ti or 2080, there around the same price so its a tricky one (I would like to play around with fstorm in the near future)

Drive- 970 Evo 500GB M.2-2280

Case- Phanteks ENTHOO EVOLV X GLASS

Psu- SeaSonic PRIME Ultra Titanium 1000W 80+ Titanium (would 1300W be better)

I have a few big projects starting soon so unfortunately I can't hold off on the build anymore. thanks!





2018-10-24, 00:18:20
Reply #178

michaltimko

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2018-10-24, 02:08:44
Reply #179

nerfherder

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The MEG board has been out of stock everywhere in the UK for months now so I ended up going with the Zenith Extreme. I'm getting my system built at OCUK and the overclocker 8Pack will be tuning my system. From his testing he recommended the Zenith board over the MEG for 24/7 rendering use at 3.9/4ghz despite the VRM limitations. I'll see how it goes and update you guys when I get the system. I'll also have an extra 120mm Noctua fan pointed at the VRM's (using a custom bracket), just for extra peace of mind.


My plan is to sell on the MEG when it returns from its RMA holiday (unless I'm feeling flush in which case I may just build another system with it). Ended up ordering the Zenith as it seems to manage its temps better than the Gigabyte. I could swap to a monoblock from EK to help cool the VRMs later down the line, but for now I'd rather just get something up and running quick and the RMA will take minimum 2 weeks. 

Sorry to jump into this post, theres some great info on this thread so I thought it's the best place to get some help with my new 2990wx build. I built my last pc 5 years ago so im a bit out of the loop. any sugestions/improvements would be greatly appreciated!

so far I have spec'd.

CPU-Threadripper 2990WX

MB-MSI MEG X399 CREATION EATX TR4 (although I just read theres some problems?)

Ram - I have spent a week looking through charts and i'm more confused than when i started (samsung B-dies only?) I may also add another 64gb in the future.

Corsair - Vengeance LED (4 x 16GB) DDR4-3000 Memory (CMU64GX4M4C3000C15)
Corsair - Vengeance LPX 64GB (4 x 16GB) DDR4-2666 Memory (CMK64GX4M4A2666C16)
Or if theres any better options that anyone has in there builds? I was looking at the G.Skill Trident Z RGB but its almost twice the price and has rgb...

Cpu Cooler- such a bad selection available but I dont trust my abilities to make a custom loop.
The best option seems to be Thermalright silver arrow TR4, although theres no reviews...and I can only seem to find it on this website
https://www.sotel.de does anyone know if its a legit site?

or theres these options...

Cooler Master Wraith Ripper
Deepcool Fryzen
Noctua - NH-U14S TR4-SP3
Enermax - LIQTECH TR4 II 360 (so many bad reviews for build quality)

GPU- either a 1080ti or 2080, there around the same price so its a tricky one (I would like to play around with fstorm in the near future)

Drive- 970 Evo 500GB M.2-2280

Case- Phanteks ENTHOO EVOLV X GLASS

Psu- SeaSonic PRIME Ultra Titanium 1000W 80+ Titanium (would 1300W be better)

I have a few big projects starting soon so unfortunately I can't hold off on the build anymore. thanks!



That's pretty much the same build I had, and although I had a reliability issue with the MEG, and the public BIOS is crap (can't speak as to the quality of the latest BETA), if it's working for you it's still a good board (make sure you buy from a retailer with a good return policy - I bought from Newegg US and they wouldn't take it, but luckily MSI stepped up). One issue I had was using the Phantexs case (which I really like) meant it was a bit tight getting the case USB panel cable into the socket on the MEG. The case has sliding panels for cable management, but I ended up removing one of them and only just managed to squeeze the cable in due to the framework of the case there.
I went for the 1300w Seasonic too, although I'm not really sure if that was overkill or not and the 1000w might be fine (someone with more knowledge on that may be able to answer, but I had it in my head that 1000+ was the way to go).
Cooler options are an issue if you don't fancy custom water, but that Silver Arrow looks reasonable in that review. Tracking some of these coolers down was a problem for me (which also drove me to try custom).

2018-10-24, 12:17:05
Reply #180

jamesdowling

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hmmm interesting, so the Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3 is coming off slightly better which is suprising.

Thanks for the heads up with the phanteks case, I think I will still get it as it just looks so good. What ram did you end up going for?

 I cant believe its so hard to find parts for this 2990wx build, its like nobody wants my money....which is a bit mental.

2018-10-24, 19:49:38
Reply #181

michaltimko

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2018-10-25, 01:57:07
Reply #182

danio1011

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Boy, I gotta say the big thing holding up my 2990wx build is just not knowing which motherboard to go for.  It seems like the Meg is the winner but needing a beta bios and hearing of failures doesn't exactly make me want to pull the trigger...

2018-10-25, 11:08:40
Reply #183

Juraj Talcik

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Just quick note since monoblocks were referenced. Do not go this way, the EKWB (and only they make them) TR4 monoblocks still feature the original small die cover plate. So it's like buying their original (v1 and v2) poor CPU block and plus VRM block together.

Super sad to see how the MSI MEG fared. We're still on 1.25 Bios, everything stable (and boot is very fast). VRM temps are fantastic without any cooler pointing on them. But, with the cooler on them, I would go with AORUS like Peter did, not Zenith. I am not sure what is the love-story some overclockers have with Zenith ( I get the love for Asus, I used 99perc. Asus boards for years, but Zenith x399 is very mediocre board for such price).

Anyway, as long as you cool your VRM it seems any board will do. MSI will just do it easiest (as long as you get functioning unit...), with no sweat.





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2018-10-25, 14:13:42
Reply #184

jamesdowling

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2018-10-26, 10:41:02
Reply #185

nerfherder

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Just quick note since monoblocks were referenced. Do not go this way, the EKWB (and only they make them) TR4 monoblocks still feature the original small die cover plate. So it's like buying their original (v1 and v2) poor CPU block and plus VRM block together.

Super sad to see how the MSI MEG fared. We're still on 1.25 Bios, everything stable (and boot is very fast). VRM temps are fantastic without any cooler pointing on them. But, with the cooler on them, I would go with AORUS like Peter did, not Zenith. I am not sure what is the love-story some overclockers have with Zenith ( I get the love for Asus, I used 99perc. Asus boards for years, but Zenith x399 is very mediocre board for such price).

Anyway, as long as you cool your VRM it seems any board will do. MSI will just do it easiest (as long as you get functioning unit...), with no sweat.

Good tip about the monoblock - thanks.
You might be very right about the Zenith.  My fun and games with motherboards continue, as I did end up ordering the zenith a few days back. Board arrives yesterday, I assemble, turn on power supply and bang - sparks and then smoke coming from the board. I'm hoping that its just a bad board, not the PSU (which I've tried in another machine and it seemed fine.)Amazon to their credit are sending me another one for tomorrow, and we'll see how that goes. My worry is that some other component was fried when the MB went pop, but hopefully, the board isolated them.
Beginning to think my Treadripper build is cursed - next time I'll order a pre-built as the amount of time and money this is costing me is getting ridiculous.

2018-10-26, 14:16:04
Reply #186

Juraj Talcik

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Sparks and smoke ?! Holy crap :- ). That's not good. It does sound like Motherboard rather than PSU issue though..at least to me.

When I test my builds, I first boot them to uefi with just PSU, MB, single memory DIM, and CPU without cooler on top, it survives (hot) just fine for minute or two. Only then I continue.
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2018-10-28, 08:47:13
Reply #187

nerfherder

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Replacement Zenith arrived yesterday and I'm up and running again! Third time lucky. And I built it exactly like you said, one component at a time (which meant it took all day to build). I can't set it up properly yet and test as I've got to go away but the temps are looking really good at the moment (CPU temp is better than ever, but that's probably down to better TIM placement on the CPU this time than anything board related). When I get back I'll get the memory speed set up correctly and set up PBO and give it some proper stress tests and see how good the temps really are. But I've never been so pleased to see a BIOS screen as I was yesterday :-)

2018-10-28, 13:30:07
Reply #188

Juraj Talcik

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Good to hear that :- ) Crossing my fingers for smooth finish in setup
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2018-10-28, 21:08:34
Reply #189

nerfherder

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Me too!!

2018-10-28, 23:45:11
Reply #190

michaltimko

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Replacement Zenith arrived yesterday and I'm up and running again! Third time lucky. And I built it exactly like you said, one component at a time (which meant it took all day to build). I can't set it up properly yet and test as I've got to go away but the temps are looking really good at the moment (CPU temp is better than ever, but that's probably down to better TIM placement on the CPU this time than anything board related). When I get back I'll get the memory speed set up correctly and set up PBO and give it some proper stress tests and see how good the temps really are. But I've never been so pleased to see a BIOS screen as I was yesterday :-)

Whats your temps ? Originally i wanted to purchase Zenith but after some proper research i went with Aorus so im curious what numbers you are getting.
Im using stock clock + NHU14s with one fan since two fans actually did nothing because of single heatsink design. CPU tends to sit at 55-58C even after several hours of rendering so im fine with it considering its on air.
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2018-11-03, 14:38:08
Reply #191

jamesdowling

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I have just finished my build and thought I would put up results for an aircooler to compare.

I'm using the Thermalright silver arrow TR4 but with a added fan. The fan is seriously loud at 100% so I got the 2nd one and im running them both at 60% full load. The machine is silent during normal work and when rendering it's an ok level.
Ram is flare X 2993 cl14 (cant seem to clock it higher and get it stable)
MSI meg creation

idle temp sits between 38-40 c
loaded rendering 67 c
PPT (cpu) 75% of 500w full load

Corona bench 3.7ghz all cores- 38sec

Cinebench 5884- all cores 3.85mhz
single- 163

Vray bench - 24 sec

I let corona render a scene for 15 hours with no crashes so everything is stable. Overall really happy with the purchase and the speed, my old machine was a 4930k though so anythings an improvement tbf!

2018-11-03, 23:08:41
Reply #192

michaltimko

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I was playing with my system a bit. I dont want to OC it since its my 24/7 machine for everything /i have xeon renderfarm for long tasks/.

So i decided to undervolt my 2990wx and im on stable -0.125mv. Cinebench gives me 5122 points so there is no power loss. Aida64 hits 52-54C /56C peak/, Corona never pushes over 52C and volatage is fluctating from 0.98x to 1.08xV.

Im using only 2 fans atm - 1x NHU14 and 1x case fan. I can barely hear my PC now even at full load. Im so damn impressed. I think there is still some room to go even lower.


loaded rendering 67 c


Keep eye on the temps, it will start to power throttle at 67,8C. During summer definitely.
« Last Edit: 2018-11-03, 23:18:48 by michaltimko »
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2018-11-05, 20:00:38
Reply #193

nerfherder

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Whats your temps ? Originally i wanted to purchase Zenith but after some proper research i went with Aorus so im curious what numbers you are getting.
Im using stock clock + NHU14s with one fan since two fans actually did nothing because of single heatsink design. CPU tends to sit at 55-58C even after several hours of rendering so im fine with it considering its on air.

Did some set up and testing over the last few days since the replacement board arrived. Current set up is the Zenith, 64gb Corsair Vengence Pro (had to downclock it a bit to 2866 as it wasn't stable), running PBO with Performance Enhancement set to Level 2 in the Bios (could have gone to lvl 3 but for now I didn't want to push it too far for now). Using a custom loop from an EK water block, 360mm rad with 3 EK Varda fans, 3 case fans (1 Noctua, 2 Phantexs that came with the case).
Temps are around 30 c at idle. Under load, cpu is at 67c, vrm at 68c. Fans are audible but not too bad at all.
Could probably spend some more time upping the power,  re-tweaking the cooling and overclocking the ram. But the performance is still great (I too have come from a 4930k, so this is definitely a big step up) and with the problems I've had over the last few weeks with the MSI board and its replacement I just need a functioning, stable machine, so I'll stay out of the BIOS for a while.

2018-11-05, 21:31:33
Reply #194

psanitra

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Running PBO, temperature wise is probably the worst option. It overvolts the CPU so so much.  Seeing 1.4-1.5v !!! on some cores it`s not rare.  For illustration i can run 3.8GHz on all cores at 1.15v  and get better temps then default PBO.
At 1.1-1.15v for all cores,the total CPU power consumption is around 275W, will get you 5850Cinebench.
Runing PBO will get you up to 300W, and get around 5200-5300 Cinebench.

So if we are talking purely about rendering performance, or 24/7 render loads, Manual OC is the way to go.

If you struggle with single tread performance or use poorly threaded applications,then PBO can help, but not much. Because, how much can you gain,going from 3.8 to 4.0-4.1 on those couple of cores that can take it..

btw, spent about a month bencharking 2990wx on Linux(ubuntu and mint) and it`s just ridiculous how much faster it is on Linux compared to Windows, some application, like Houdini, up to  30% on simulations(pyro/grains/).
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2018-11-06, 01:24:24
Reply #195

nerfherder

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Cheers for the heads up there - having said I would just leave the system as is for now, I was straight back into the BIOS.

Now running a manual OC at 3.8 all cores at 1.15v, and like you getting around 5750-5850 on Cinebench. Will now do some more through stress testing to check stability.

2018-11-06, 01:48:17
Reply #196

psanitra

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Great, let us know how it went. For me 3.8 at 1.1v rendering for hours was working fine, no crashes. But i was getting crashes in houdini simulations, so i bumped it a bit to 1.15 and running smooth now. I guess this really is silicon lottery territory, you might get lucky and run lower then me, or not :)
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2018-11-06, 11:16:53
Reply #197

Juraj Talcik

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I see undervolting is all the fashion :- ). I am not the biggest fan, and neither of manual OC. PBO might take voltage higher but it also preserves your single core turbo. I would much rather have 4.2 Single core than better voltage on all-core and be limited to <3.8.

Of course, it heavily depends on your cooling and motherboard. For Air cooling, it's definitely good thing and seeing how good temperatures you can get this way with Noctua makes me happy. But if you already spent money on custom loop, go PBO.
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2018-11-08, 11:27:06
Reply #198

nerfherder

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Great, let us know how it went. For me 3.8 at 1.1v rendering for hours was working fine, no crashes. But i was getting crashes in houdini simulations, so i bumped it a bit to 1.15 and running smooth now. I guess this really is silicon lottery territory, you might get lucky and run lower then me, or not :)

Well, I stressed tested it an all was well. Shut it down and the in the morning it wouldn't post :(. Flashed the bios and it booted fine (and has done ever since) and have just left it at stock for now. Just going to leave it be for now, actually use the machine for work and then think about what to do next. Even at stock its an awesome system and a big performance boost for me, but I'll probably look into either PBO or manual OC in a few weeks.

2018-11-08, 13:13:20
Reply #199

Juraj Talcik

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The pesky windows 10 update that secretly bundles up micro-code ( KB4100347 ) keeps on installing and somehow downregulating turbo speed (only noticeable in single-core). Without any change to voltage or power, from 4.1Ghz to 3.7Ghz. That is 10perc. single-core performance I do not like being gone. Finally blocked that update from re-installing. Instantly fixed.

I didn't do so previously because I've heard some following update had fixed this behavior but apparently that isn't such case. Also hoped bios update would fix this in meantime. Didn't happen either...MSI.

I am still super-baffled by this. It's Spectre patch, it shouldn't do much to AMD system yet it does ! I hope it doesn't come secretly bundled with another big update next season.


If in some case some you have trouble with turbos, check if KB4100347 isn't installed (as long as you have v1803 edition build).


In other news, for MEG owners, there is another private beta bios, comes with updated AGESA and some users reports stable memory clocks up to 3166 Mhz (with 8x8 sticks though, haven't seen any 4x16/8x16 confirm) so memory compatibility and stableness is improved. I did not try it myself yet.
« Last Edit: 2018-11-08, 13:26:16 by Juraj Talcik »
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2018-11-09, 22:45:47
Reply #200

jpjapers

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The pesky windows 10 update that secretly bundles up micro-code ( KB4100347 ) keeps on installing and somehow downregulating turbo speed (only noticeable in single-core). Without any change to voltage or power, from 4.1Ghz to 3.7Ghz. That is 10perc. single-core performance I do not like being gone. Finally blocked that update from re-installing. Instantly fixed.

I didn't do so previously because I've heard some following update had fixed this behavior but apparently that isn't such case. Also hoped bios update would fix this in meantime. Didn't happen either...MSI.

I am still super-baffled by this. It's Spectre patch, it shouldn't do much to AMD system yet it does ! I hope it doesn't come secretly bundled with another big update next season.


If in some case some you have trouble with turbos, check if KB4100347 isn't installed (as long as you have v1803 edition build).


In other news, for MEG owners, there is another private beta bios, comes with updated AGESA and some users reports stable memory clocks up to 3166 Mhz (with 8x8 sticks though, haven't seen any 4x16/8x16 confirm) so memory compatibility and stableness is improved. I did not try it myself yet.

If someone can post like an 'ideal' config for a system with this cpu ill put it in the first post. This has gone way deeper than i can follow now haha.
Im looking at upgrading at work and it would certainly help to have some idea of what components work well together.

2018-11-10, 20:25:14
Reply #201

PsychoBoyJack

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[quote author=Juraj Talcik link=topic=21416.msg137474#msg137474 date=1541679200


In other news, for MEG owners, there is another private beta bios, comes with updated AGESA and some users reports stable memory clocks up to 3166 Mhz (with 8x8 sticks though, haven't seen any 4x16/8x16 confirm) so memory compatibility and stableness is improved. I did not try it myself yet.
[/quote]

Are other 2990wx MBs stable which >2933Mhz memory ?

2018-11-11, 14:34:00
Reply #202

Juraj Talcik

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No, it has mostly to do with the chipset, not much the MB manufacturers can do about. You might be able to get it stable higher with smaller amount (and smaller capacity) sticks, but that isn't very rational choice for 2990WX.

MEG is still the best board to get performance wise, while feature set is richer (4x dual-slot PCI-e slots & 10gbe nic on board) on Aorus Xtreme.

We can wait and see what the x499 will bring on to the table.
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2018-11-13, 14:16:01
Reply #203

cedrus deodara

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Recently bought 2990wx system:

f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx(optimized for AMD)
aorus xtreme x399
seasonic 1300w
samsung 970 pro 512gb
NZXT kraken 72x(67 degrees on full load stock frequency) 5050 Cinebench and about 40seconds corona benchmark(basically everything as expected)

But....

Everything in the start seemed vanilla good until I started experiencing lags and constant freezing on heavy scenes 40gb or more when loaded into Ram. Gets very annoying after some time. And "smoothness" is even worse than on my previous systems like 5960x and Ryzen 1800X. I am fully aware that Max utilises only single core during tasks like ui, saving, opening file etc. but isn't main problem NUMA architecture itself that isn't yet fully optimized on windows 10?

2018-11-13, 16:16:03
Reply #204

PsychoBoyJack

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Recently bought 2990wx system:

f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx(optimized for AMD)
aorus xtreme x399
seasonic 1300w
samsung 970 pro 512gb
NZXT kraken 72x(67 degrees on full load stock frequency) 5050 Cinebench and about 40seconds corona benchmark(basically everything as expected)

But....

Everything in the start seemed vanilla good until I started experiencing lags and constant freezing on heavy scenes 40gb or more when loaded into Ram. Gets very annoying after some time. And "smoothness" is even worse than on my previous systems like 5960x and Ryzen 1800X. I am fully aware that Max utilises only single core during tasks like ui, saving, opening file etc. but isn't main problem NUMA architecture itself that isn't yet fully optimized on windows 10?

perhaps not related but the memory you listed (f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx) doesnt appear on the motherboard QVL http://download.gigabyte.eu/FileList/Memory/mb_memory_x399-aorus-xtreme_2nd.pdf
« Last Edit: 2018-11-13, 16:24:06 by PsychoBoyJack »

2018-11-13, 16:32:23
Reply #205

cedrus deodara

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prolly not related but the memory you listed (f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx) doesnt appear on the motherboard QVL http://download.gigabyte.eu/FileList/Memory/mb_memory_x399-aorus-xtreme_2nd.pdf

actually g.skill website says aorus xtreme motherboard is on QVL https://www.gskill.com/en/product/f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx
Maybe list from gigabyte isn't up to date.

2018-11-13, 16:39:16
Reply #206

PsychoBoyJack

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prolly not related but the memory you listed (f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx) doesnt appear on the motherboard QVL http://download.gigabyte.eu/FileList/Memory/mb_memory_x399-aorus-xtreme_2nd.pdf

actually g.skill website says aorus xtreme motherboard is on QVL https://www.gskill.com/en/product/f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx
Maybe list from gigabyte isn't up to date.
yah this is strange.
i found another qvl for this card where the memory f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx appears.
http://download.gigabyte.cn/FileList/Memory/mb_memory_x399-aorus-xtreme.pdf


i don't know which pdf is the most recent tho. the one where your ram doesnt appear has the mention "2nd" at the end of its name.

edit: from this page http://download.gigabyte.cn/FileList/Memory/  it seems the one which doesnt contain your ram is the most recent
edit 2 : http://download.gigabyte.cn/FileList/Memory/mb_memory_x399-aorus-xtreme_2990WX.pdf   this seems to be the good pdf to look at (doesnt contain f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx)
« Last Edit: 2018-11-13, 16:52:47 by PsychoBoyJack »

2018-11-13, 17:17:14
Reply #207

cedrus deodara

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Quote
yah this is strange.
i found another qvl for this card where the memory f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx appears.
http://download.gigabyte.cn/FileList/Memory/mb_memory_x399-aorus-xtreme.pdf


i don't know which pdf is the most recent tho. the one where your ram doesnt appear has the mention "2nd" at the end of its name.

edit: from this page http://download.gigabyte.cn/FileList/Memory/  it seems the one which doesnt contain your ram is the most recent
edit 2 : http://download.gigabyte.cn/FileList/Memory/mb_memory_x399-aorus-xtreme_2990WX.pdf   this seems to be the good pdf to look at (doesnt contain f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx)

Makes me think because Xmp for 2933 appears to be working stable also there are no indications apart from absence in gigabytes listings that ram shouldn't do.
Off course before buying i checked qvl's there and there, and wasn't concerned this memory would create any performance drops(and doubting it is to be blamed) as it is advertised as high performance memory for x399 platforms.
Also reading from this thread psanitra has same memory in his build without any complains.


2018-11-13, 17:29:54
Reply #208

PsychoBoyJack

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Makes me think because Xmp for 2933 appears to be working stable also there are no indications apart from absence in gigabytes listings that ram shouldn't do.
Off course before buying i checked qvl's there and there, and wasn't concerned this memory would create any performance drops(and doubting it is to be blamed) as it is advertised as high performance memory for x399 platforms.
Also reading from this thread psanitra has same memory in his build without any complains.


Yes perhaps memory is not to be blamed. Just noticed this little strangeness. I am currently trying to build a 2990wx system and stumbled on the same incoherence where the gskill qvl listed my board but the board qvl was not listing the ram.
I think now I'll try to respect the board qvl  instead of the memory one. We never know.

good luck finding whats slowing you down. keep the thread updated :) if you can

« Last Edit: 2018-11-13, 17:36:13 by PsychoBoyJack »

2018-11-13, 17:47:08
Reply #209

cedrus deodara

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yes perhaps memory is not to be blamed. just noticed this little strangeness. i am currently trying to build a 2990wx system and stumbled on the same incoherence where the gskill qvl listed my board but the board qvl was not listing the ram.
i think now ill try to respect at board qvl  instead of the memory one. we never know.

good luck finding whats slowing you down. keep the thread updated :) if you can
will continue on testing and looking for solution
Thanks for your input and good luck finding right parts for your build.

2018-11-13, 18:25:19
Reply #210

Juraj Talcik

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That smoothness can be many things. Right now we use as workstation highly clocked i9 7980XE and 2990WX and I can say I can't perceive any slowness compared to the i9 which has better memory access (single die to all channels) and better IPC. BUT, we know the issue is there.
First I would try to install Ryzen Master and try the newest Dynamic Local Mode. It will shuffle single-thread heavy processes onto cores with direct memory access.

I will put second possibility only as crude option, but even single-core CPU utilization can throttle performance if those few cores hit thermal limit (particularly under PBO). I feel that with kraken x72 that might be the case because of poor die coverage. Imho air-cooler with full heatspreader cover like U14S-TR4 is superior to small coverage of the Asetec units.

There is no issue with your memory and I doubt that would manifest in this way.

And last, look at my last post regarding Spectre patch. If you can't uninstall the patch due to latest install build, you can replace the .dlls with the older version (though I just renamed them as soft-delete without any issue).
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2018-11-13, 22:40:30
Reply #211

psanitra

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Hey, i`m running that same kit you talking about  f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx on same board no issues. Over past 2 months i`ve tried all 3 bioses available, all work fine. Only time i was experiences any crashed was when i was testing extreme overclocks. 
If you run CPU at stock clock speeds, and runnning ram at profile 1(2933) there should be no issues. If i have to wild guess, maybe it`s the AIO cooler, or terrible air flow i case with overheating VRM. 68 deg Celsius, at this temp CPU should start throttling already...  Both are easy to check, run HWiNFO64 and let us know what temps you getting. Look for CPU(Tdie) and VRM MOS.  Just run a long render that utilize CPU at 100%, watch the windows task manager 100% cpu line and if it starts dipping occasionally, you are in trouble :)
« Last Edit: 2018-11-13, 22:46:02 by psanitra »
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2018-11-15, 12:40:20
Reply #212

cedrus deodara

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That smoothness can be many things. Right now we use as workstation highly clocked i9 7980XE and 2990WX and I can say I can't perceive any slowness compared to the i9 which has better memory access (single die to all channels) and better IPC. BUT, we know the issue is there.
First I would try to install Ryzen Master and try the newest Dynamic Local Mode. It will shuffle single-thread heavy processes onto cores with direct memory access.

I will put second possibility only as crude option, but even single-core CPU utilization can throttle performance if those few cores hit thermal limit (particularly under PBO). I feel that with kraken x72 that might be the case because of poor die coverage. Imho air-cooler with full heatspreader cover like U14S-TR4 is superior to small coverage of the Asetec units.

There is no issue with your memory and I doubt that would manifest in this way.

And last, look at my last post regarding Spectre patch. If you can't uninstall the patch due to latest install build, you can replace the .dlls with the older version (though I just renamed them as soft-delete without any issue).

Hello Juraj.
Thanks for valuable tips.
I tried some fixing and here are the results:
Somehow previously PBO wasn't enabled albeit it was set on"creator mode". Same I guess with Dynamic local mode it should be on by default but it didn't seemed to do it's job. So I reset my BIOS and I reinstalled Ryzen master and the result is like day and night. It does feel more responsive and smooth, 3dsmax is not freezing like crazy anymore. I am really pleased.

Yes agree, kraken x72 isn't best fit for full die coverage, my initial thought was to find decent AiO, so there would be less hassle with custom loop solution, but after intense searching conclusion is that there isn't out atleast for now aio I am looking, so between existing ones x72 with tr4 bracket seemed most attractive.

Regarding Spectre patch issue I will look more in depth because update KB4100347 wasn't present.

2018-11-15, 13:22:36
Reply #213

cedrus deodara

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Hey, i`m running that same kit you talking about  f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx on same board no issues. Over past 2 months i`ve tried all 3 bioses available, all work fine. Only time i was experiences any crashed was when i was testing extreme overclocks. 
If you run CPU at stock clock speeds, and runnning ram at profile 1(2933) there should be no issues. If i have to wild guess, maybe it`s the AIO cooler, or terrible air flow i case with overheating VRM. 68 deg Celsius, at this temp CPU should start throttling already...  Both are easy to check, run HWiNFO64 and let us know what temps you getting. Look for CPU(Tdie) and VRM MOS.  Just run a long render that utilize CPU at 100%, watch the windows task manager 100% cpu line and if it starts dipping occasionally, you are in trouble :)

Hello psanitra, thanks for suggestions.
I ran render test for about an hour and checked temps with HWiNFO64 CPU(Tdie) 68.2 degrees, VRM MOS constant at 66 degrees, but cpu frequency indeed starts jumping back and forth from 3100 to 3000, cpu utilization from 100% to 92%. Think this could be sign of thermal throttling. In addition I checked device itself unfortunately one of the 3 fans isn't spinning at all. Will try to fix this and see if it does better.

2018-11-15, 19:31:54
Reply #214

lupaz

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Right now we use as workstation highly clocked i9 7980XE and 2990WX and I can say I can't perceive any slowness compared to the i9 which has better memory access

Juraj, overall, are you happier with your i9 build or 2990WX?

Thanks.

2018-11-16, 11:32:26
Reply #215

Juraj Talcik

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I would say 2990WX, it's lot more high-end build as well :- ). I went all out with the cooling and parts on it, with intention to get the most out of it in terms of performance (while keeping excellent acoustics). I've succeeded in that despite the baby pains with bios and software part.
The i9, I tried to build it in very budget way because I got the CPU for relatively cheap (1200 euro). But then I paid for delidding and the results were not stellar anyway. I would need a board with much more than 8 phases that my Asus has (all boards were like that for x299 with like three exceptions), and same powerful loop if I would want to keep it highly clocked (4.4+ Ghz) while keeping it silent (<30dB). I contemplated rebuilding it into custom loop as well, with better board. But then again, it feels like wasting even more money on it...

Neither is perfect as highly clocked i9 gets almost same performance in Corona compared to 2990WX with half as many cores only !. The difference is opposite in everything else (like Marvelous Designer simulation, etc..), so Corona perhaps runs against the memory limitations of Threadripper architecture.
With Dynamic Local Mode, single-thread performance should also feel pretty much the same in all apps as well (like working in 3dsMax and Photoshop, and it does, both feel equally smooth I would say).

For future, I still feel Threadripper will continue to get better because the IPC is getting up (Intel struggles and only rises clocks), the infinity fabric is improving, ram speeds are going up and costs will go down as manufacturing this architecture is relatively cheap.
But future Intel ? The "28c" i9, if it even comes to market, will be hugely overpriced, it requires 20+ Phases (the boards are ridiculous), will required crazy overbuilt water-loop (like mine, but not for high-overclock, but to simply get it running).

At this moment I am still lot more partial towards AMD :- ).
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2018-11-17, 02:46:12
Reply #216

lupaz

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Thanks so much. Really appreciate it.
Interesting to know the single thread performance is about the same on both.

2018-11-19, 16:26:53
Reply #217

PsychoBoyJack

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Excuse me, I see in this thread multiple mentions of how 2933 is for the moment the highest stable freq for 2990wx but I can't find this info elsewhere.
Where does the info come from ?

Thank you

edit: i found https://en.wikichip.org/wiki/amd/ryzen_threadripper/2990wx
« Last Edit: 2018-11-19, 16:48:30 by PsychoBoyJack »

2018-11-19, 17:09:25
Reply #218

Juraj Talcik

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QVL lists aren't definite on all options as they test only a certain subset, but it gives you solid idea nonetheless.  You can see that when you reach certain amount of ranks (by going above 64 GB configurations, esp. when using 16 GB modules) the highest stable tested frequency for such memory configuration is 2933 MHz.
Now, lot of enthusiasts play around with custom timings (and usually on custom versions of modified bios) to get around such limitations but I haven't seen much of that around for 2990WX. And I surely wouldn't go for "barely stable benchmark setup" on my workstation. Lower single digit potential performance advantage vs potential loss of work, that's not tough choice imho.

You can buy 3600 or 4000 MHz memory configurations and then simply try yourself, 'maybe' you'll get lucky ;- ).

Still, you can go for best binned versions with tighter timings, i.e CAS15 & 2933 vs CAS19.

(I assumed you just wrongly worded your question, but you are asking about stable memory frequency right ? That is when that number comes from. Not CPU frequency).

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2018-11-19, 17:23:48
Reply #219

PsychoBoyJack

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(I assumed you just wrongly worded your question, but you are asking about stable memory frequency right ? That is when that number comes from. Not CPU frequency).
yes i was talking about memory frequency.

Thanks for your answer.

2018-11-22, 14:39:47
Reply #220

jpjapers

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Can someone recommend a good x399 motherboard with 10 gigabit connectivity?

2018-11-22, 17:42:27
Reply #221

Juraj Talcik

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Can someone recommend a good x399 motherboard with 10 gigabit connectivity?

I am aware of only three options:

1) Asus Zenith Extreme. Just not a good board (8 VRM phases for CPU, terrible cooling), absolutely not for its price. The 10Gbit is not integrated and comes in form of rebranded Aquantia Lan Card which you can buy separately for 100 euros. It blocks 1 of the 4 slots thus, preventing 4xGPU use.
2) Asrock Fatality Extreme.  Not great board either (8 VRM phases for CPU), the 10Gbit is integrated into board.
3) Gigabyte Aorus Extreme. Much better than the two above (10 VRM phases for CPU and better heatsink), the 10Gbit is integrated.

Imho the choice is clear. Aorus.
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2018-11-22, 21:30:20
Reply #222

jpjapers

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Can someone recommend a good x399 motherboard with 10 gigabit connectivity?

I am aware of only three options:

1) Asus Zenith Extreme. Just not a good board (8 VRM phases for CPU, terrible cooling), absolutely not for its price. The 10Gbit is not integrated and comes in form of rebranded Aquantia Lan Card which you can buy separately for 100 euros. It blocks 1 of the 4 slots thus, preventing 4xGPU use.
2) Asrock Fatality Extreme.  Not great board either (8 VRM phases for CPU), the 10Gbit is integrated into board.
3) Gigabyte Aorus Extreme. Much better than the two above (10 VRM phases for CPU and better heatsink), the 10Gbit is integrated.

Imho the choice is clear. Aorus.

Thanks, i looked at the MIS MEG as it has dual lan but thought perhaps one of them was 10gb but no.
Would you recommend the MEG plus a pci card or would the gigabyte suffice? I dont see us doing any overclocking really.

2018-11-22, 22:18:52
Reply #223

Juraj Talcik

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If you don't plan on overclocking than there is no need for MSI MEG. MSI MEG plus 10gbit card is almost 200 euros over the other choices and leave you with only 3 usable dual-slots.

Aorus is no-brainer choice for you :- ).

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2018-11-26, 21:07:28
Reply #224

philipb

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Am I an idiot for thinking I can build a setup based on Asus ROG Srtix 399X?

I don't know enough about power delivery, phases ect to evaluate the question.  I am hoping for a mild overclock, maybe 3.7-3.8 which seems doable without going to crazy power draw. Looking at the DeBauer OC guide for reference. The Strix has an 8pin+4pin power, while the Zenith has 8+8pin. But, apparently both have 8 power phases? Please feel free to correct me, I'm not even sure what the power phases imply exactly.

Really hoping Enermax get their shit together, would be nice to just buy a 360 from them and get decent cooling. Here in Canada all the stock is gone on Amazon, so hopefully, the old revisions have been removed and new stock will be improved. Maybe not though.

Looking forward to your thoughts...definitely starting to get anxious about this build reding through this thread.






2018-11-27, 18:14:43
Reply #225

Juraj Talcik

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Am I an idiot for thinking I can build a setup based on Asus ROG Srtix 399X?

I don't know enough about power delivery, phases ect to evaluate the question.  I am hoping for a mild overclock, maybe 3.7-3.8 which seems doable without going to crazy power draw. Looking at the DeBauer OC guide for reference. The Strix has an 8pin+4pin power, while the Zenith has 8+8pin. But, apparently both have 8 power phases? Please feel free to correct me, I'm not even sure what the power phases imply exactly.

Really hoping Enermax get their shit together, would be nice to just buy a 360 from them and get decent cooling. Here in Canada all the stock is gone on Amazon, so hopefully, the old revisions have been removed and new stock will be improved. Maybe not though.

Looking forward to your thoughts...definitely starting to get anxious about this build reding through this thread.








Can you get it much cheaper than Aorus Xtreme ? Unless yes, I would not do so for the 100 euro difference. It's inferior board and I say this as owner of X299 Strix for my i9 (but I got it as deal for 200 euros so I was ok with mediocre board). Asus actually upgraded the Intel version (Strix-E into second revision of XE) by revising their poor VRM heatsink. The never did this for AMD version, which tells you all you need. This is not a good board for 2990WX.

All Asus boards in lineup currently have 8 phases and poor heatsinks (hence why they sell stupid 4cm fan for Zenith you can mount to "help").

Reg phases: VRM phases supply juice (voltage) to the CPU. The more of them, the more stable is the voltage output and potentially better heat dissipation given same mosfet quality (so that is yes for high-end boards for x299 & x399 platforms), leading to safer and stable operation (and higher potential of stable overclock). You can get by with less phases but they easily get over-stressed and require considerable active cooling.

Power connectors do just that..bring power to the board :- ), before it feds through the VRM phases as usable voltage for the CPU.
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2018-11-27, 19:49:48
Reply #226

philipb

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Yeah, that's the thing, I got a smoking deal on it. All the high-end boards are around 600 in Canada, and none went on sale for black Friday. I'm talking the zenith, the MEG etc. I got the Strix for around 300, so half that.  If the Strix and the Zenith essentially have the same power delivery then I'll likely take my chances with the Strix. If I'm reading your comments right, it's clearly inferior to a top-shelf board but will still work.

I'm not looking to hit 4.1 OC or something. If I can hit a stable 3.6-3.8 that will be more than good enough. I'm only considering Enermax or Noctua for cooling. Based on the DeBauer graph that's under 300W so hopefully will be workable with the Strix.

I mean, I have the cash for a better board, but not sure if I'll get any benefit from it. Higher OC's look like they need serious cooling and I'm not considering going that route, so a board that gets me to that 3.6-3.8 range should be fine. But then, maybe I am being optimistic.

PS. Juraj, are all the issues with the MEG cleared up? Running solid with public BIOS? Also, appreciate getting your input. Thanks.


2018-11-27, 20:29:56
Reply #227

Juraj Talcik

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Ok, that can be considered good deal, go for it then ;- ). The power delivery is the same, but the heatsink is lot worse, so you will have to account for this with good case airflow, and ideally additional fan pointed towards the VRM.

Btw people are quite hyperbolic with the overclocking numbers in general, 4.1 OC is not "high", it's the practical limit of this CPU and territory where every other board then MEG will be in smokes from VRM.
Also Debauer's numbers are based on manual under-volting, you might not win silicon lottery for that to reach same voltage with stability. But as Peter Sanitra and Michal Timko have demostrated, people have great results mostly.

The BIOS ? Well, depends. For me, yes but as you see elsewhere on this forum, James had issue with stability on latest beta. And I checked the MSI forums, and it seems people with RAID have trouble (but seriously, don't use RAID in your workstation in 2018, it's never good idea, never ever). Apparently the issue is because MSI is slow to release drivers for latest Win10 distribution (Gigabyte releases their drivers in October ahead).

Truth be told looks like this platform overall (x399) just isn't being given much priority, perhaps due to amount of sold units. Niche platform, issues take longer to resolve.
But I would feel safe about this, x399 has still at least two years of lifespan, so all kinks will be ironed out as these boards need to support another generation of hardware.
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2018-11-28, 21:02:41
Reply #228

jpjapers

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Looking at some systems for work.

2990WX
64gb 2666Mhz Ram (potential upgrade in the future to 128gb if it becomes necessary)
1070 Ti
Aorus X399 eXtreme
Evo 970 500gb
RM850 PSU
Noctua TR4 Cooler with an additional 120mm fan on the rear.

Any suggestions/comments/critique?

2018-12-02, 23:00:30
Reply #229

philipb

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First things first. Question, is everyone respecting the 68C thermal limit with their manual clocks? I haven't seen anyone recommend going above it. Also, are people undervolting their PBO? Im on ASUS and using the offset to under volt the PBO with - 0.1 CV.


Okay, got my 'cheap' setup going.

ROG Strix 399-e
2990wx
64GB Corsair LP 3200
Enermax Tr4 280 (I know, I know. Actually got it used from Kijiji, its now 9 months old and no issues. Ill RMA it and get the gen 2 asap)
Evo 970

Testing on an open-air bench, with a Quadro 600 until its time to swap out as my main workstation.

For now, can get 37 seconds on Corona Bench and 23-24 on Vray. Playing with both PBO and Manual clock. With PBO the board Throttles at 68C of course and ends up dropping from the initial 3.8 (the max all core PBO from a cool starting point) to anywhere from 3.5-2.9 depending on the task. Corona and Vray benchmarks tend to average around 3.4-3.25. Prime 95 FFT test sends it right down to 2.9-3.0, while the blend test results in 3.4-3.5.  I can get similar performance from a manual OC, but it runs a bit hotter than the 68C recommended, requiring 1.145 CV to maintain a stable-ish 3.7. For now, I'll take the PBO result and be happy with that.

Some observations...
-Strix board seems to be doing fine so far. VRM has gone up to 76C (open bench of course). Power delivery has been adequate for what I'm doing. It's definitely not a limiting factor at this level of Performance/thermal limit. That being said, I need to do longer term testing. I remember seeing someone with a MEG board say they were getting stable 3.8 Manual with 1.1 CV. definitely need much more here, 1.14-1.15 to get close to stable, and then my cooling becomes an issue..

- Enermax is doing a decent job. hope it doesn't explode. When I RMA the gen 1 for gen 2 ill see if I can upgrade to 360.

- I like this new type of Overclocking. The thermal limit is set and the MOBO does all the work. That's a step forward. Long as the board isn't shit (and mine might be) if you want better performance, just buy better cooling.

2018-12-04, 16:34:17
Reply #230

PsychoBoyJack

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I 'm  using Noctua NH u14s with double mounted fan to cool my system.
I' m curious about other idle and "loaded" temps with  solutions like wraithripper, enermax, or custom.

my Tdies are :  idle 28-29 C  and loaded 48-49 C . Room temp is 20 C.


2018-12-05, 04:40:42
Reply #231

philipb

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I 'm  using Noctua NH u14s with double mounted fan to cool my system.
I' m curious about other idle and "loaded" temps with  solutions like wraithripper, enermax, or custom.

my Tdies are :  idle 28-29 C  and loaded 48-49 C . Room temp is 20 C.

Have you turned on PBO, AMD's automatic overclocking?

If your temps aren't 68C at Load then you are leaving a good deal of performance on the table. PBO should overclock your CPU until it hits its thermal limit at 68C. On ASUS boards this feature is called performance enhancement in the BIOS. Not sure what its called for other boards. But maybe you are holding back for noise, or VRM overheat?

There are comparisons out there. Google around. From what I saw Wraith and Noctua are neck and neck, the silver arrow is a bit better, and Enermax is the winner, maybe by 6-10C over Noctua. But there have been lots of problems with the Liqtech rev.1, huge fail rate, and some leaking. Rev.2 maybe be better, but the jury is still out.

On a personal note, I have been waiting like 5 business days for a proper RMA response from Enermax. Just terrible. Unfortunately, they are the only game in town right now on the AIO side.


2018-12-05, 14:04:24
Reply #232

PsychoBoyJack

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I 'm a bit afraid to overclock and burn my MB/CPU. Isn't it dangerous (overheat and crash/burn/die ?) ? doesn't it reduce the components lifespan ?
« Last Edit: 2018-12-05, 14:10:40 by PsychoBoyJack »

2018-12-05, 21:57:25
Reply #233

jpjapers

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I 'm a bit afraid to overclock and burn my MB/CPU. Isn't it dangerous (overheat and crash/burn/die ?) ? doesn't it reduce the components lifespan ?

If done properly and cooling is sufficient to keep the dies below their max temp you should be fine

2018-12-06, 11:20:05
Reply #234

Juraj Talcik

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It only took 6 months, but the II generation of Liqtech is now publicly available after going through two iterations within same timeframe. Since this is basically 4th edition, perhaps it's finally bug-free :- ) ?

https://www.guru3d.com/news-story/enermax-launches-liqtech-iiuniversal-aio-liquid-cooler-with-tdp-500-watts.html
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2018-12-06, 12:55:26
Reply #235

jpjapers

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Looking at some systems for work.

2990WX
64gb 2666Mhz Ram (potential upgrade in the future to 128gb if it becomes necessary)
1070 Ti
Aorus X399 eXtreme
Evo 970 500gb
RM850 PSU
Noctua TR4 Cooler with an additional 120mm fan on the rear.

Any suggestions/comments/critique?

@Juraj you seem to be well informed. Could you give any crit to the above spec? Or make any swaps/changes? Im not looking to overclock but if the thermals allow for it i wouldnt mind seeing where i can get to with it.

2018-12-08, 15:05:01
Reply #236

Juraj Talcik

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Don't see anything to critique, that will work well :- ). If you could find withing similar price range, or close-enough, a 2933 memory, I would do that as the difference can be noticed with Corona and other memory intensive workloads, but it's not crucial.
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2018-12-08, 20:02:53
Reply #237

michaltimko

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I 'm  using Noctua NH u14s with double mounted fan to cool my system.
I' m curious about other idle and "loaded" temps with  solutions like wraithripper, enermax, or custom.

my Tdies are :  idle 28-29 C  and loaded 48-49 C . Room temp is 20 C.

There is literally zero benefits running two fans on NH14 (pull - push). I noticed more noise while having 2 fans running and i did 2x 4hr test with 1 and 2 fans and difference was 1C.
Problem is that its single heatsink design. Hope they will release NH15 in future.
« Last Edit: 2018-12-09, 12:16:58 by michaltimko »
Coronaut!(c)2011

Supporting Corona in commercial projects since pre-alpha

2018-12-08, 20:25:02
Reply #238

Juraj Talcik

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They were very reluctant to make changes that would accomodate D15 on TR4 and I think they denied working on anything for TR4 on this year's Computex.

It would require new positioning for the heatpipes and while that might seem like minor thing, Noctua says it takes them half a year of work to make black version of their latest 120mm Sterrox fan.
I really wouldn't count on them releasing D15 for TR4 any soon..if ever.
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2018-12-09, 00:24:13
Reply #239

jpjapers

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They were very reluctant to make changes that would accomodate D15 on TR4 and I think they denied working on anything for TR4 on this year's Computex.

It would require new positioning for the heatpipes and while that might seem like minor thing, Noctua says it takes them half a year of work to make black version of their latest 120mm Sterrox fan.
I really wouldn't count on them releasing D15 for TR4 any soon..if ever.

Are there any better cooling solutions i should be considering?

2018-12-10, 18:36:17
Reply #240

philipb

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Are there any better cooling solutions i should be considering?

It's been mentioned here a few times... The Enermax Liqhtec tr4 gen.2

You can see the Gen.1 performance advantage here. The issue was that gen.1 had all kind of problems that would lead to failure...
https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3089-threadripper-cooler-comparison-full-coverage-liquid-vs-air

Supposedly, the current (there were maybe even problems with the first batch of gen.2) Liqtech TR4's have all the issues resolved. I'm taking the gamble as the performance is clearly good. I have a gen.1 280 that is still working fine after 9months and its good stuff. But I will RMA it for a new Gen.2 just to be safe.

2018-12-10, 19:13:09
Reply #241

Vuk

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I am in the same spot as you are. Got a 280 working fine nearly a year now on the 1950x but I am not sure if you can RMA the cooler if its working ok now or they are taking it RMA's without any questions?

2018-12-11, 10:36:55
Reply #242

jpjapers

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Are there any better cooling solutions i should be considering?

It's been mentioned here a few times... The Enermax Liqhtec tr4 gen.2

You can see the Gen.1 performance advantage here. The issue was that gen.1 had all kind of problems that would lead to failure...
https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3089-threadripper-cooler-comparison-full-coverage-liquid-vs-air

Supposedly, the current (there were maybe even problems with the first batch of gen.2) Liqtech TR4's have all the issues resolved. I'm taking the gamble as the performance is clearly good. I have a gen.1 280 that is still working fine after 9months and its good stuff. But I will RMA it for a new Gen.2 just to be safe.

Is it overkill if i dont plan on overclocking?

2018-12-11, 11:54:28
Reply #243

Juraj Talcik

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There is no such thing as overkill cooling. If you don't use the performance, you'll trade it in for silence.

And Enermax is of course doing some good old marketing, it's 500W rated...as long as you let the fans run at 2000rpm. It's not overkill in true sense at all, it's just much better solution than other available.
I would probably trust it right now.
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2018-12-12, 20:32:54
Reply #244

philipb

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Is it overkill if i dont plan on overclocking?

Juraj said it...but think of it this way.

Its not really overclocking anymore....these new CPUs are capable of automatic all core turbo boost. Overclocking used to be a project in itself, now its a feature.

  If you don't use it you are just leaving performance on the table, rotting fruit on the vine. The real question is, how much do you want to spend on cooling, and that breaks down into a performance/noise/cost trade-off.

In other words....just do it!

2018-12-13, 07:37:30
Reply #245

ivabox

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So after reading tons of pages for this processor, I want to ask one last time:) Do you guys recommend 2990WX over 7980xe. In terms of performance I am sold, everything looks fine, but I am really afraid of that ram problem, we work with really huge scenes, generally it uses all of the 128GB of ram, so what would you guys suggest? (Also we couldnt not find 7980xe available right now in Turkey, but AMD is ready to ship)

2018-12-13, 11:46:03
Reply #246

Juraj Talcik

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Hi,

I have both. My personal suggestion is 2990WX being superior as overall package. Now regards to the "ram problem":

- What is it that concerns you ? The fact only half of dies are connected to memory directly ? This affects only single-threaded performance and is alleviated by recent Ryzen software which basically does automatical project lasso, it shuffles processes like 3dsMax and Photoshop into those physical cores that have direct memory access. With PBO, you keep high single-core performance on par with i9, so applications run on the same smoothness.

- Or maybe the fact that affinity fabric within dies together affects the overall performance even multithreaded due to latency. This is very application specific but even with this latency delay, Corona is still faster, and the other workloads where this manifests, like file compression, etc.. are usually very small times regardless. In practical terms, this is more about not using the potential of the CPU to the fullest within certain applications, but still come ahead of the i9.

Now the benefits of 2990WX:

- You can choose from two great boards (MSI MEG and Aorus Xtreme). For x299, there is only recently introduced MSI MEG. Otherwise you're stuck with bunch of 8-phased VRMs for most part.
- In future, next or the following year, you would still be able to upgrade to 48 or even possible 64-core Threadripper. I would say though, that this will only be possible on MSI MEG (or otherwise necessitize X499).
- Excellent thermals. Short of VRMs, for which you have better boards, 2990WX runs much cooler than i9 at comparative clocks. Yes i9 can be clocked slightly higher, but due to AVX instructions, it becomes hell-fire.
- Thus every 2990WX can be overclocked, even on air cooler ! But for i9, you need to win silicon lottery and get a good chip, delid the heatspreader and replace the paste, and then live with terrible accoustics ;- ).

I only kept my i9 because what I am gonna waste time&money now trying to sell it.
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2018-12-13, 14:30:06
Reply #247

ivabox

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Thanks for the answer,

What we read from some of the reviews, people claim that AMD crashes much more than intel. Of course speed and performance is important but if the scene crashes a lot, there wont be any meaning. However as you do not comment on it, and also bios updates will cover most of it (as with other threadrippers before)there wont be any problem I guess. thanks again.

2018-12-13, 15:03:30
Reply #248

Juraj Talcik

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This is first time I ever hear about CPU architecture (AMD in this case) being the cause of crashing. That is some serious nonsense. People with stupid builds, cheap underpowered PSUs, odd idiosyncratic settings in bios, overclocked CPUs beyond VRM capacity, not enough voltage, million stuff where people are only to blame themselves.
Even the people who come to Corona forum with the "Only Corona crashes my PC to blue screen  !!", well no shit, you probably didn't stress your PC before enough with full AVX load (on top of GPU utilization). Your build is to blame, not the software.

Early bios versions are always hassle, but it's purely MB manufacturer's fault, and fully unrelated to CPU.


People also claim the earth is flat, sometimes it's better not to read the internet proletariat with their collective wisdom. I am pretty sure this rumor is from gaming forums because those are most guilty of building crappy PCs and strange settings.


None of my PCs crashed in years. They all are almost 24/7 at 100perc., the workstations at 1000+ Watt each.
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2018-12-14, 07:22:51
Reply #249

philipb

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VRM thermal issues... Time to rethink the ASUS ROG STRIX. Should have listened to Juraj.

I have received my Enermax TR4 Gen.2 360. This was an upgrade from my gen.1 280. It let me push the PBO to overclock a good bit further. However, after putting everything in the case (R6) I can see that the thermals on the VRM will be unsustainable.

Testing with prime-95 blend (which goes up and down in terms of stress) the VRM temps are touching 100C, with a 120mm fan 2 inches away blasting at 100%, shit. Running blend the temps get to 103, and are often in the high 80s to low 90s. FTT testing takes the temps to over 100C within 10 min, again with the same fan setup...crazy! Running corona the temp levels out at 94-95C around 30 min, don't think that's sustainable, is it? And its, loud, of course.

I'm attaching a graph, it shows a longer Blend run in prime 95, and then a short FFT run after a period to let everything cool off. It shows the problem very clearly. The performance is great, but the VRM is a disaster.

Juraj, I'm curious what the VRM thermals are like on the MEG? Now that I have a better AIO the VRM are showing themselves to be the weak link. I can still return the ASUS, and given the cash I already have in this system it seems a few hundred more for stability and maximized performance would be worth the tradeoff.

Damnit, I guess its time to tear this thing apart for now.



« Last Edit: 2018-12-14, 10:13:03 by philipb »

2018-12-14, 14:08:15
Reply #250

Juraj Talcik

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Don't panic :- ). Common mosfets (even average quality ones) are rated for 120C. But lot of circuits around can start to deteroriate at roughly 105C. I see you often pass this peak.

VRM is often poorly cooled by even the best airflow, which is why people come up with all sorts of hacks by trying to point a fan directly onto the VRM. It makes a bit of chaos in overall airflow but can help the temps up to 20C.

Regarding my VRM temps I think I would have to measure it again at different voltages. I really didn't touch that PC at all since I gave it to Veronika. I think they never went above 80.

Definitely try to get some fan pointed at the VRMs. People with Aorus often do so and they have 10 phases for the CPU (versus 8), better heatsink, and most people in this thread under-volted.

Btw, if the noise from Enermax feels annoying, you can swap the native fans for Noctua Sterrox (NF-A12x25). I know it's not budget solution but they're state of art in terms of airflow/accoustics.
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2018-12-17, 22:31:01
Reply #251

philipb

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Don't panic :- ). Common mosfets (even average quality ones) are rated for 120C. But lot of circuits around can start to deteroriate at roughly 105C. I see you often pass this peak.

VRM is often poorly cooled by even the best airflow, which is why people come up with all sorts of hacks by trying to point a fan directly onto the VRM. It makes a bit of chaos in overall airflow but can help the temps up to 20C.

Regarding my VRM temps I think I would have to measure it again at different voltages. I really didn't touch that PC at all since I gave it to Veronika. I think they never went above 80.

Definitely try to get some fan pointed at the VRMs. People with Aorus often do so and they have 10 phases for the CPU (versus 8), better heatsink, and most people in this thread under-volted.

Btw, if the noise from Enermax feels annoying, you can swap the native fans for Noctua Sterrox (NF-A12x25). I know it's not budget solution but they're state of art in terms of airflow/accoustics.

Okay, yes I have calmed down.

Running Corona the VRM seems to stay under 95C with a fan pointed at them. If Vray also stays under 100C (haven't tested yet) then I will likely keep the ROG STRIX board. Im also having an issue where the PC wont wake from sleep using AUS PBO, but if I use Ryzen-master it does. Ill see if i can get that fixed. If not i might consider another board.

Yes, Ill definitely change over to Noctua fans, as these Enermax ones are loud. That being said the Enermax gen.2 seems to be very good. Hopefully, they have worked out all the problems and it won't quickly fail like the Gen.1 versions.

2019-01-03, 18:08:18
Reply #252

michaltimko

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2019-01-03, 23:43:52
Reply #253

philipb

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https://www.hardocp.com/news/2019/01/03/amd_ryzen_threadripper_2990wx_performance_regressions_linked_to_windows_bug

https://bitsum.com/portfolio/coreprio/

For slovak / czech speakers https://www.svethardware.cz/chaby-vykon-threadripperu-2990wx-byl-identifikovan-jako-dusledek-chyby-v-kernelu-windows/48337

Seems to slow down Corona benchmark by 2 seconds for me. Doesn't appear to have any impact on Vray benchmark. May still be a good idea to run, either way, to ensure that dynamic local mode is running as a permanent service. For 7-zip there is apparently some benefit.

Anyone else loses a second or two with corona bench?
« Last Edit: 2019-01-04, 00:09:34 by philipb »

2019-01-04, 11:41:06
Reply #254

maru

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<slightly offtopic> looks like some Threadripper prices dropped recently (at least in Europe), which makes them even more affordable</slightly offtopic>
https://geizhals.eu/amd-ryzen-threadripper-1950x-yd195xa8aewof-a1664849.html
https://geizhals.eu/amd-ryzen-threadripper-1920x-yd192xa8aewof-a1664904.html

2019-01-06, 11:54:57
Reply #255

michaltimko

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https://www.hardocp.com/news/2019/01/03/amd_ryzen_threadripper_2990wx_performance_regressions_linked_to_windows_bug

https://bitsum.com/portfolio/coreprio/

For slovak / czech speakers https://www.svethardware.cz/chaby-vykon-threadripperu-2990wx-byl-identifikovan-jako-dusledek-chyby-v-kernelu-windows/48337

Seems to slow down Corona benchmark by 2 seconds for me. Doesn't appear to have any impact on Vray benchmark. May still be a good idea to run, either way, to ensure that dynamic local mode is running as a permanent service. For 7-zip there is apparently some benefit.



Anyone else loses a second or two with corona bench?

Corona benchmark is same for me but in cinebench i gained like 100-150 points.
« Last Edit: 2019-01-06, 14:05:45 by michaltimko »
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2019-01-26, 02:40:20
Reply #256

nickmilitello

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How did someone get 37 secs bench time.  I have a 2990wx or to 4.0 with 32 go ram and I had a score of 1:12. What am I doing wrong?

2019-01-26, 02:41:57
Reply #257

philipb

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How did someone get 37 secs bench time.  I have a 2990wx or to 4.0 with 32 go ram and I had a score of 1:12. What am I doing wrong?


I can get 37-39 seconds at 3.8ghz...3200 on memory.

You got 4 DIMM's??? Running quad channel memory? I noticed in my initial testing during the build that having 4 DIMMs (i.e. running quad channel) made a huge difference... Also ram speed makes a difference. Even going from 3200 to 3400 I got a second or two improvement, but can't get anything over 3200 stable.
« Last Edit: 2019-01-26, 02:46:19 by philipb »

2019-02-07, 14:29:16
Reply #258

michaltimko

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How did someone get 37 secs bench time.  I have a 2990wx or to 4.0 with 32 go ram and I had a score of 1:12. What am I doing wrong?

Post your pc specs here
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2019-02-11, 10:03:10
Reply #259

Juraj Talcik

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Got solved in other thread, guy bought slow memory :- ) Fixed it by changing that.

In other news, for MSI MEG users, the file from 1Usmus (1.31Mod) is apparently going to become the stable official release file. I didn't test yet, will be doing systems updates soon.
https://www.overclock.net/forum/27779864-post496.html
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2019-02-12, 11:41:37
Reply #260

jalapeno

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Does CL matter here?
With the same money I can buy:
G.SKILL TRIDENTZ 64GB (4X16GB) DDR4 3200MHZ (F43200C14Q64GTZ)
or
G.SKILL TRIDENT Z RGB 64GB DDR4 (F43600C17Q64GTZR)

I'm going to run it on MSI MEG and only first one are on msi supported hw page so thinking about them.
« Last Edit: 2019-02-12, 11:50:30 by jalapeno »

2019-02-12, 12:18:36
Reply #261

jpjapers

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So i think i'm at a point with my prospective spec i'm happy with.
Anyone seeing any issues or bottlenecks? Id maybe look at faster ram if the price wasn't too much of an increase.


RM850X PSU
Samsung Evo 970 500GB boot drive
64GB Corsair Vengeance 2666mhz RAM
Threadripper 2990wx
Enermax Liqtech TR4 360mm
AORUS X399 Xtreme
RTX 2070
Fractal define R6 Case + 3x additional 140mm fans

2019-02-12, 12:34:06
Reply #262

Juraj Talcik

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Does CL matter here?
With the same money I can buy:
G.SKILL TRIDENTZ 64GB (4X16GB) DDR4 3200MHZ (F43200C14Q64GTZ)
or
G.SKILL TRIDENT Z RGB 64GB DDR4 (F43600C17Q64GTZR)

I'm going to run it on MSI MEG and only first one are on msi supported hw page so thinking about them.

Both denote the overall speed of memory, so when it comes to CL14 @3000 vs CL16 @3000, the former is better but won't make drastic difference on Threadripper.
With that said, you won't be able to run more than 3200Mhz @4x16GB capacity on 2990WX, it's simply not stable even with the latest AGESA update. Maybe in future, but not worth the time/risk and additional money on diminishing returns.
There isn't much to be gained after 2933.

Get the cheapest CL14-15 @2933(3000) memory you can get at 4x16GB capacity and instead either save your money or buy more memory.

So i think i'm at a point with my prospective spec i'm happy with.
Anyone seeing any issues or bottlenecks? Id maybe look at faster ram if the price wasn't too much of an increase.

64GB Corsair Vengeance 2666mhz RAM


Likewise, do get 2933MHz (3000), don't go lower ;- ).
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2019-02-12, 13:03:18
Reply #263

jpjapers

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Likewise, do get 2933MHz (3000), don't go lower ;-).

Corsair do have 3000mhz RAM in the vengeance range i think.

2019-02-12, 13:21:58
Reply #264

Juraj Talcik

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Likewise, do get 2933MHz (3000), don't go lower ;-).

Corsair do have 3000mhz RAM in the vengeance range i think.

Yup, I run Vengeance myself on 2990WX. There are billion revisions of it, and only some of them might have made it onto QVL lists, but that doesn't mean others won't work. Sometimes new revisions comes almost every few months. If you happen to buy memory that won't run which should be rare with the latest AGESA updates (always run bios update before confirming full compatibility, most boards can run them automatically from USB key).

Whether you buy one denoted as 2933 or 3000 is the very same hardware just different package marketing, both will run at 2933 on Threadripper.
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2019-02-12, 13:46:37
Reply #265

jpjapers

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Likewise, do get 2933MHz (3000), don't go lower ;-).

Corsair do have 3000mhz RAM in the vengeance range i think.

Yup, I run Vengeance myself on 2990WX. There are billion revisions of it, and only some of them might have made it onto QVL lists, but that doesn't mean others won't work. Sometimes new revisions comes almost every few months. If you happen to buy memory that won't run which should be rare with the latest AGESA updates (always run bios update before confirming full compatibility, most boards can run them automatically from USB key).

Whether you buy one denoted as 2933 or 3000 is the very same hardware just different package marketing, both will run at 2933 on Threadripper.

Good to know thank you

2019-02-12, 19:03:25
Reply #266

philipb

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So i think i'm at a point with my prospective spec i'm happy with.
Anyone seeing any issues or bottlenecks? Id maybe look at faster ram if the price wasn't too much of an increase.


RM850X PSU
Samsung Evo 970 500GB boot drive
64GB Corsair Vengeance 2666mhz RAM
Threadripper 2990wx
Enermax Liqtech TR4 360mm
AORUS X399 Xtreme
RTX 2070
Fractal define R6 Case + 3x additional 140mm fans

1) Isn't 850W cutting it close for a 2990WX build???

The processor can draw 500W, add the GPU and other stuff and you must be pushing 800W or close already.  If you ever plan on adding a second GPU or anything you may not have enough juice. But then it all depends on if you are overclocking, which you should be for sure with the Enermax. I'm happy with the new Enermax revision, it can do consistent 3.8ghz with PBO @ 475W or so.

2) Also, this video scared me off the Aorus...

t

3) Ram speed does make a difference...if you can get faster ram then do.

2019-02-13, 09:32:39
Reply #267

jalapeno

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If you still have doubts with choosing motherboard check this. Test results are at 10:27

2019-02-13, 14:41:48
Reply #268

orion

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Hello all,
I'm little bit confused about the choice of the motherboard, as in the video we can see that the ASUS zenith xtreme got better VRM temps than the AOrus Xtreme x399,the MSI MEG X399 si the best but i'm going to build a GPU/CPU rendering workstation so i need a quad GPU Motherboard,do you have an idea about which one is better for a little bit OC of the 2990wx with good vrm temps ? AORUS XTREME or Zenith Xtreme ?

Also one question i'm using a lot of Corona and gonna use C4D Octane also, it need a lot of single core speed,so i have a question what is the speed of the 2990wx compared to the 2950x in a legacy mode of 1/2 ? i did researchs but i did not understand it.

Comming build : ( 2990WX- ASUS XT REME X399 or AORUS Xtreme X399-Ram 64 GB 4*16GB PREDATOR GSKILL 3000 MHZ- PSU Crosair AX 1600W- RTX 2080TI ASUS TURBO BLOWER EDITION-Noctua NH 14S for now )
Thank you
« Last Edit: 2019-02-13, 14:55:15 by orion »

2019-02-13, 19:04:54
Reply #269

Juraj Talcik

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Aorus is clear winner against Zenith (vanilla version, as there is now also Zenith Alpha but it doesn't fit 4 GPUs for the same reasons MSI MEG doesn't, the VRM mosfets push the real estate away and it wouldn't fit into E-ATX format).

Aorus has better VRM and that is more important, you need to actively cool both with good air flow or hack some fan solution on top.

It's incredibly poor state of affairs that MSI MEG and ZENITH ALPHA didn't go for SSI board format as the E-ATX ended up crippling their GPU capability.
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2019-02-14, 21:53:13
Reply #270

jpjapers

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I dont plan on overclocking as ive never done it and obviously we need them to be stable. I might one day. I liked the system on the ASUS Prime with a hardware dial for overclocking that turned up to eleven haha

2019-02-14, 22:05:44
Reply #271

philipb

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With the new 'PBO system' its not really overclocking like it used to be, don't think there are any stability issues to worry about anymore. You just turn it on, and it will find the thermal capability of your cooling (enermax is good!) and take it up to that thermal limit safe and stable.

Honestly, if you don't turn on PBO you are just leaving money/power on the table. For the price you paid and the performance these chips are capable of getting an extra 15-20% out of your 2990WX is really not something you should pass up.

Check it out. You just get ryzen master and set the power limit, maybe 400-450 W. That's all. Thought you may need to point a fan at your VRM. I have a cheap ASUS 399-e board (got a deal) and since pointing a fan at the VRM I haven't had any issues running at 3.5-3.8 Ghz.


2019-02-15, 15:57:00
Reply #272

orion

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Aorus is clear winner against Zenith (vanilla version, as there is now also Zenith Alpha but it doesn't fit 4 GPUs for the same reasons MSI MEG doesn't, the VRM mosfets push the real estate away and it wouldn't fit into E-ATX format).

Aorus has better VRM and that is more important, you need to actively cool both with good air flow or hack some fan solution on top.

It's incredibly poor state of affairs that MSI MEG and ZENITH ALPHA didn't go for SSI board format as the E-ATX ended up crippling their GPU capability.
I asked for price and the MSI MEG X399 is cheaper in my country then the AORUS by almost 80dollars, do you know if we can use a PCI-E slit riser in the MSI MEG X399 to expand to  a quad GPU Setup?
The VRM can be safe on a 4ghz overclock or 4.1GHZ( 2990wx ) in an AORUS xtreme and NOCTUA fans for air cooling the case ?

2019-02-15, 16:21:23
Reply #273

Juraj Talcik

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4.0-4.1 would be pushing it, but you don't mention what CPU cooler would be or how you would intend to cool the VRM. Have a look at Peter Sanitra build in this thread.

Yeah you can use risers believe, but if you opt for 4x2080(Ti), you will have to use two risers as the NVLink bridge is hardpiece.
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2019-02-18, 14:31:23
Reply #274

orion

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For cooling i don't know how to build a watercooling system neither the part needed , so i m thinking about using the corsair a150i pro for this cpu; do you have any idea about it?
IF you have any watercooling system under 350USD it will be usefull
« Last Edit: 2019-02-18, 23:25:56 by orion »

2019-02-18, 16:08:11
Reply #275

jpjapers

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For cooling i don't know how to build a watercooling system neither the part needed , so i m thinking about using the corsair a150i pro for this cpu; do you have any idea about it?
IF you have any watercooling system under 250USD it will be usefull

Enermax LiqTech TR4 offers better die coverage

2019-02-18, 19:24:11
Reply #276

orion

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For cooling i don't know how to build a watercooling system neither the part needed , so i m thinking about using the corsair a150i pro for this cpu; do you have any idea about it?
IF you have any watercooling system under 250USD it will be usefull

Enermax LiqTech TR4 offers better die coverage
Yes but even the REV 2 are reported to be failling