Author Topic: Threadripper Builds  (Read 27073 times)

2018-11-13, 18:25:19
Reply #210

Juraj Talcik

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That smoothness can be many things. Right now we use as workstation highly clocked i9 7980XE and 2990WX and I can say I can't perceive any slowness compared to the i9 which has better memory access (single die to all channels) and better IPC. BUT, we know the issue is there.
First I would try to install Ryzen Master and try the newest Dynamic Local Mode. It will shuffle single-thread heavy processes onto cores with direct memory access.

I will put second possibility only as crude option, but even single-core CPU utilization can throttle performance if those few cores hit thermal limit (particularly under PBO). I feel that with kraken x72 that might be the case because of poor die coverage. Imho air-cooler with full heatspreader cover like U14S-TR4 is superior to small coverage of the Asetec units.

There is no issue with your memory and I doubt that would manifest in this way.

And last, look at my last post regarding Spectre patch. If you can't uninstall the patch due to latest install build, you can replace the .dlls with the older version (though I just renamed them as soft-delete without any issue).
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2018-11-13, 22:40:30
Reply #211

psanitra

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Hey, i`m running that same kit you talking about  f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx on same board no issues. Over past 2 months i`ve tried all 3 bioses available, all work fine. Only time i was experiences any crashed was when i was testing extreme overclocks. 
If you run CPU at stock clock speeds, and runnning ram at profile 1(2933) there should be no issues. If i have to wild guess, maybe it`s the AIO cooler, or terrible air flow i case with overheating VRM. 68 deg Celsius, at this temp CPU should start throttling already...  Both are easy to check, run HWiNFO64 and let us know what temps you getting. Look for CPU(Tdie) and VRM MOS.  Just run a long render that utilize CPU at 100%, watch the windows task manager 100% cpu line and if it starts dipping occasionally, you are in trouble :)
« Last Edit: 2018-11-13, 22:46:02 by psanitra »
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2018-11-15, 12:40:20
Reply #212

cedrus deodara

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That smoothness can be many things. Right now we use as workstation highly clocked i9 7980XE and 2990WX and I can say I can't perceive any slowness compared to the i9 which has better memory access (single die to all channels) and better IPC. BUT, we know the issue is there.
First I would try to install Ryzen Master and try the newest Dynamic Local Mode. It will shuffle single-thread heavy processes onto cores with direct memory access.

I will put second possibility only as crude option, but even single-core CPU utilization can throttle performance if those few cores hit thermal limit (particularly under PBO). I feel that with kraken x72 that might be the case because of poor die coverage. Imho air-cooler with full heatspreader cover like U14S-TR4 is superior to small coverage of the Asetec units.

There is no issue with your memory and I doubt that would manifest in this way.

And last, look at my last post regarding Spectre patch. If you can't uninstall the patch due to latest install build, you can replace the .dlls with the older version (though I just renamed them as soft-delete without any issue).

Hello Juraj.
Thanks for valuable tips.
I tried some fixing and here are the results:
Somehow previously PBO wasn't enabled albeit it was set on"creator mode". Same I guess with Dynamic local mode it should be on by default but it didn't seemed to do it's job. So I reset my BIOS and I reinstalled Ryzen master and the result is like day and night. It does feel more responsive and smooth, 3dsmax is not freezing like crazy anymore. I am really pleased.

Yes agree, kraken x72 isn't best fit for full die coverage, my initial thought was to find decent AiO, so there would be less hassle with custom loop solution, but after intense searching conclusion is that there isn't out atleast for now aio I am looking, so between existing ones x72 with tr4 bracket seemed most attractive.

Regarding Spectre patch issue I will look more in depth because update KB4100347 wasn't present.

2018-11-15, 13:22:36
Reply #213

cedrus deodara

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Hey, i`m running that same kit you talking about  f4-2933c14q2-128gtzrx on same board no issues. Over past 2 months i`ve tried all 3 bioses available, all work fine. Only time i was experiences any crashed was when i was testing extreme overclocks. 
If you run CPU at stock clock speeds, and runnning ram at profile 1(2933) there should be no issues. If i have to wild guess, maybe it`s the AIO cooler, or terrible air flow i case with overheating VRM. 68 deg Celsius, at this temp CPU should start throttling already...  Both are easy to check, run HWiNFO64 and let us know what temps you getting. Look for CPU(Tdie) and VRM MOS.  Just run a long render that utilize CPU at 100%, watch the windows task manager 100% cpu line and if it starts dipping occasionally, you are in trouble :)

Hello psanitra, thanks for suggestions.
I ran render test for about an hour and checked temps with HWiNFO64 CPU(Tdie) 68.2 degrees, VRM MOS constant at 66 degrees, but cpu frequency indeed starts jumping back and forth from 3100 to 3000, cpu utilization from 100% to 92%. Think this could be sign of thermal throttling. In addition I checked device itself unfortunately one of the 3 fans isn't spinning at all. Will try to fix this and see if it does better.

2018-11-15, 19:31:54
Reply #214

lupaz

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Right now we use as workstation highly clocked i9 7980XE and 2990WX and I can say I can't perceive any slowness compared to the i9 which has better memory access

Juraj, overall, are you happier with your i9 build or 2990WX?

Thanks.

2018-11-16, 11:32:26
Reply #215

Juraj Talcik

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I would say 2990WX, it's lot more high-end build as well :- ). I went all out with the cooling and parts on it, with intention to get the most out of it in terms of performance (while keeping excellent acoustics). I've succeeded in that despite the baby pains with bios and software part.
The i9, I tried to build it in very budget way because I got the CPU for relatively cheap (1200 euro). But then I paid for delidding and the results were not stellar anyway. I would need a board with much more than 8 phases that my Asus has (all boards were like that for x299 with like three exceptions), and same powerful loop if I would want to keep it highly clocked (4.4+ Ghz) while keeping it silent (<30dB). I contemplated rebuilding it into custom loop as well, with better board. But then again, it feels like wasting even more money on it...

Neither is perfect as highly clocked i9 gets almost same performance in Corona compared to 2990WX with half as many cores only !. The difference is opposite in everything else (like Marvelous Designer simulation, etc..), so Corona perhaps runs against the memory limitations of Threadripper architecture.
With Dynamic Local Mode, single-thread performance should also feel pretty much the same in all apps as well (like working in 3dsMax and Photoshop, and it does, both feel equally smooth I would say).

For future, I still feel Threadripper will continue to get better because the IPC is getting up (Intel struggles and only rises clocks), the infinity fabric is improving, ram speeds are going up and costs will go down as manufacturing this architecture is relatively cheap.
But future Intel ? The "28c" i9, if it even comes to market, will be hugely overpriced, it requires 20+ Phases (the boards are ridiculous), will required crazy overbuilt water-loop (like mine, but not for high-overclock, but to simply get it running).

At this moment I am still lot more partial towards AMD :- ).
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2018-11-17, 02:46:12
Reply #216

lupaz

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Thanks so much. Really appreciate it.
Interesting to know the single thread performance is about the same on both.

2018-11-19, 16:26:53
Reply #217

PsychoBoyJack

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Excuse me, I see in this thread multiple mentions of how 2933 is for the moment the highest stable freq for 2990wx but I can't find this info elsewhere.
Where does the info come from ?

Thank you

edit: i found https://en.wikichip.org/wiki/amd/ryzen_threadripper/2990wx
« Last Edit: 2018-11-19, 16:48:30 by PsychoBoyJack »

2018-11-19, 17:09:25
Reply #218

Juraj Talcik

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QVL lists aren't definite on all options as they test only a certain subset, but it gives you solid idea nonetheless.  You can see that when you reach certain amount of ranks (by going above 64 GB configurations, esp. when using 16 GB modules) the highest stable tested frequency for such memory configuration is 2933 MHz.
Now, lot of enthusiasts play around with custom timings (and usually on custom versions of modified bios) to get around such limitations but I haven't seen much of that around for 2990WX. And I surely wouldn't go for "barely stable benchmark setup" on my workstation. Lower single digit potential performance advantage vs potential loss of work, that's not tough choice imho.

You can buy 3600 or 4000 MHz memory configurations and then simply try yourself, 'maybe' you'll get lucky ;- ).

Still, you can go for best binned versions with tighter timings, i.e CAS15 & 2933 vs CAS19.

(I assumed you just wrongly worded your question, but you are asking about stable memory frequency right ? That is when that number comes from. Not CPU frequency).

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2018-11-19, 17:23:48
Reply #219

PsychoBoyJack

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(I assumed you just wrongly worded your question, but you are asking about stable memory frequency right ? That is when that number comes from. Not CPU frequency).
yes i was talking about memory frequency.

Thanks for your answer.

2018-11-22, 14:39:47
Reply #220

jpjapers

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Can someone recommend a good x399 motherboard with 10 gigabit connectivity?

2018-11-22, 17:42:27
Reply #221

Juraj Talcik

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Can someone recommend a good x399 motherboard with 10 gigabit connectivity?

I am aware of only three options:

1) Asus Zenith Extreme. Just not a good board (8 VRM phases for CPU, terrible cooling), absolutely not for its price. The 10Gbit is not integrated and comes in form of rebranded Aquantia Lan Card which you can buy separately for 100 euros. It blocks 1 of the 4 slots thus, preventing 4xGPU use.
2) Asrock Fatality Extreme.  Not great board either (8 VRM phases for CPU), the 10Gbit is integrated into board.
3) Gigabyte Aorus Extreme. Much better than the two above (10 VRM phases for CPU and better heatsink), the 10Gbit is integrated.

Imho the choice is clear. Aorus.
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2018-11-22, 21:30:20
Reply #222

jpjapers

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Can someone recommend a good x399 motherboard with 10 gigabit connectivity?

I am aware of only three options:

1) Asus Zenith Extreme. Just not a good board (8 VRM phases for CPU, terrible cooling), absolutely not for its price. The 10Gbit is not integrated and comes in form of rebranded Aquantia Lan Card which you can buy separately for 100 euros. It blocks 1 of the 4 slots thus, preventing 4xGPU use.
2) Asrock Fatality Extreme.  Not great board either (8 VRM phases for CPU), the 10Gbit is integrated into board.
3) Gigabyte Aorus Extreme. Much better than the two above (10 VRM phases for CPU and better heatsink), the 10Gbit is integrated.

Imho the choice is clear. Aorus.

Thanks, i looked at the MIS MEG as it has dual lan but thought perhaps one of them was 10gb but no.
Would you recommend the MEG plus a pci card or would the gigabyte suffice? I dont see us doing any overclocking really.

2018-11-22, 22:18:52
Reply #223

Juraj Talcik

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If you don't plan on overclocking than there is no need for MSI MEG. MSI MEG plus 10gbit card is almost 200 euros over the other choices and leave you with only 3 usable dual-slots.

Aorus is no-brainer choice for you :- ).

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2018-11-26, 21:07:28
Reply #224

philipb

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Am I an idiot for thinking I can build a setup based on Asus ROG Srtix 399X?

I don't know enough about power delivery, phases ect to evaluate the question.  I am hoping for a mild overclock, maybe 3.7-3.8 which seems doable without going to crazy power draw. Looking at the DeBauer OC guide for reference. The Strix has an 8pin+4pin power, while the Zenith has 8+8pin. But, apparently both have 8 power phases? Please feel free to correct me, I'm not even sure what the power phases imply exactly.

Really hoping Enermax get their shit together, would be nice to just buy a 360 from them and get decent cooling. Here in Canada all the stock is gone on Amazon, so hopefully, the old revisions have been removed and new stock will be improved. Maybe not though.

Looking forward to your thoughts...definitely starting to get anxious about this build reding through this thread.