Author Topic: VRay 3.0 SP1  (Read 25380 times)

2014-12-12, 06:24:09
Reply #30

Christa Noel

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This is exactly why I got REALLY excited about the new Vray sp1 and after spending a few hours testing it, I realized all it is doing is trying to be Corona.. but not as well.  For our stills (and probably animation with the new HDcache) We won't be going back to Vray any time soon here at the studio.
many other renderer users are quite shocked at the first time they try corona (most of them are vr & me too). i imagine about how some companies got headache everyday caused by thinking of how to plan them strategy to defend their market, especially when they meet the new hardcore competitor & how curiously they breakdown competitor engine to find out what the must to do list.
go corona, you have your own path. if there are some engine try to run your path, let them but just don't loose the lead.

2014-12-12, 12:06:42
Reply #31

cecofuli

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LINK to new VRay Opacity explanation

LINK

2014-12-12, 12:30:49
Reply #32

Ludvik Koutny

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LINK to new VRay Opacity explanation

LINK


Haha, so basically they took that idea from Corona too :D

2014-12-12, 12:38:30
Reply #33

cecofuli

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Yes, if you have:

(*) black and white opacity map (no gray colors) + filtering off = Clip mode

2014-12-12, 14:47:39
Reply #34

borisquezadaa

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There even was a discussion here on the forum about the best image format  for opacity and accordingly gif format was the fastest.I wonder if...
What i do with Corona My Corona post of random stuff rendering
WARNING: English.dll still loading...

2014-12-16, 15:03:32
Reply #35

DeadClown

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So, I finally installed SP1 here and.... wtf (no, this is not a fanboy rant or something like that, just someone who is working with vray each day) , what did they do to the whole UI stuff. I mean, the rendersettings dialog is already fubar but now they saw some need to fuck up the VrayMtl controls too. Seriously... this is NOT how improvements should look like, it's chaotic, names and controls all scattered everywhere and no clear "concept" anymore...

*sigh*
Any sufficiently advanced bug is indistinguishable from a feature.

2014-12-16, 15:11:50
Reply #36

Juraj Talcik

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It looks more logical to me compared to previous but albeit not perfect, that's for sure.. They took interpolation out because it never made sense to have it outside of its control which were always under options.

They integrated Akin's calculator thingy because certain "power users" begged for it 5 years straight. Imho they should have taken the subdivs completely out as Vlado intented, but you can't fight power users.
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2014-12-16, 15:16:39
Reply #37

DeadClown

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I don't understand how it works, I just see some numbers without any useful logic

[Edit] actually that's exactly how this vray 3 release feels to me. "someone wanted it - so we implemented it, I don't give a sh** if it makes things more complicated, don't touch anything and you're fine."
« Last Edit: 2014-12-16, 15:21:39 by DeadClown »
Any sufficiently advanced bug is indistinguishable from a feature.

2014-12-16, 15:34:30
Reply #38

cecofuli

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DeadClown, we worked with the old VRay UI for 10 years. Obviously, for us, now it isn't comfortable. But they just reposition some options.
About the calculator, Chaos Group need an official, CLEAR explanation. Because, for me, it was one of the arguments that it sended me far away from V-Ray.
I hadn't time to read 10 discussion with 80 pages about noise in VRay produced by wrong settings about AA, subdivs, noise threshold, control render elements.
I remember, one or two years ago.... A veeery long thread about noise. Every user said own opinion. And no one official replied by Vlado.
it was unprofessional, and now, if you read the general section on Chaogroup forum, there are so many discussion about the same argument...
Pfff... I hope Corona will not follow the same direction.

2014-12-16, 15:42:54
Reply #39

Juraj Talcik

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actually that's exactly how this vray 3 release feels to me. "someone wanted it - so we implemented it, I don't give a sh** if it makes things more complicated, don't touch anything and you're fine."

That's very correct though, yes. The current philosophy seems to be to set the defaults as Vlado intends (simple, works without touching), but at same time, implement every single clutter thing people ask on forum.

It's compromise that pleases everyone, but just isn't the best approach in long run. At times, it can appear very schizofrenic.
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2014-12-16, 15:55:30
Reply #40

DeadClown

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DeadClown, we worked with the old VRay UI for 10 years. Obviously, for us, now it isn't comfortable. But they just reposition some options.
Well, that's probably true. It just looks so messy to me now. The render dialog is smaller now, everything is somehow compressed into weird arrangements or hidden behind expert modes and stuff like that...

About the calculator, Chaos Group need an official, CLEAR explanation. Because, for me, it was one of the arguments that it sended me far away from V-Ray.
I hadn't time to read 10 discussion with 80 pages about noise in VRay produced by wrong settings about AA, subdivs, noise threshold, control render elements.
The thing is, I think I know how the DMC, subdivs etc works. I have clean and fast results with my settings and my optimizations - but I just don't know what the values in the material here mean.

It's compromise that pleases everyone, but just isn't the best approach in long run.
Not me ;) And I don't think it works at all. They have settings for everything but also encourage to just use the most "basic" controls. The presets script dialog for example is complete bullshit. A user would assume that pushing every slider to 100% would give great results but may render a bit longer. But no, it renders crap plus takes forever.
« Last Edit: 2014-12-16, 16:01:09 by DeadClown »
Any sufficiently advanced bug is indistinguishable from a feature.

2014-12-16, 16:02:59
Reply #41

cecofuli

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Yes, the different between basic, normal, expert subdivision isn't so useful IMO.
DeadClown, now it could be clear. But remember how many pages or test and time you lost to understand from the begin... =) It isn't acceptable in the 2014.

2011, 35 pages, now one reply by Chaougroup!! That thread was embarrassing.

http://forums.chaosgroup.com/showthread.php?54547-About-noise-in-general&highlight=noise

As you said you have your settings, your optimization. But, why not an official explanation?
The unique official guide was the "Universal Setting". And you remember how much confusion it created ;-)

2014-12-16, 16:12:22
Reply #42

DeadClown

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I'm not using the Vray forum anymore. So I'm not aware of all these weird threads :D The problem with the vray forum is that a huge amount of people spread a lot of wrong information and no official chaosgroup member is clarifying it (apart from Vlado here and there).
Yes, I spent a lot of time learning how DMC is working but actually the best (and only) ressource you need to understand this whole thing is the "Demystifying DMC" article http://www.interstation3d.com/tutorials/vray_dmc_sampler/demistyfing_dmc.html. If you read it 2 or 3 times and make your tests, it's all relatively easy.
But I second your opinion, it shouldn't be necessary today. And as you can see with Corona, it works well without.

[Edit] Same thing with LWF, a lot of people still don't know how it works. It's actually really easy but since so many people spread so much false information in the vray forum some people didn't even bother to learn it. There were a lot of articles explaining it right and wrong and no one knew which one was the which. So if Vlado just wrote a short article it would have helped a lot back then.
« Last Edit: 2014-12-16, 16:17:06 by DeadClown »
Any sufficiently advanced bug is indistinguishable from a feature.

2014-12-16, 16:19:08
Reply #43

cecofuli

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I read so many time that thread. Also translated in Italian =)
Yes, you are right, except for DOF and MB, where Corona needs some adaptation =)
But, soon, we will have, I'm sure!

2014-12-16, 16:26:52
Reply #44

Juraj Talcik

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Every forum can become community of self-perpetuated bullshit :- ) I think the issue with Chaos is not so often perpetuated non-sense but half-truths when people stay and keep suggesting the the same railroaded approach they've learned somewhere without fundamentally truly understanding the reasoning behind it. Or they brainwashed themselves into believing of the understanding.

I think Vray3.1 is quite great, it's possible to be used in absolutely easy manner, almost like Corona. The fact it's surrounded by so much confusion by vast majority (90perc+) of users is rather perplexing though and reveals incorrect communication approach from Vlado's team. But they're in tough position, Vray has been on market for so long people basically adopted it as their child and with that, their way of using it. Confronting it, cutting away the non-essential, would be painful and emotional fight. Which always leads to neither cat nor dog result.

But if you see through that, it does work and it does work well :- )
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