Poll

What variant is the best?

Slim buttons on left, icons+text
4 (23.5%)
Slim buttons on left, icons only
2 (11.8%)
Buttons on top
11 (64.7%)
Thick buttons on left
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 15

Author Topic: How should the frame buffer look?  (Read 16766 times)

2013-01-19, 16:23:08
Reply #30

alieneye

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i like nuke UI as well as lacilaci version :)

it`s still need some work but looks good

2013-01-19, 16:24:37
Reply #31

loocas

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Honestly, i think that wanting VFB to be a complete post production tool and wanting it to be simple and fast goes against each other.

You should keep in mind that VFB will be most of the time displaying output while rendering, therefore CPU usage will be 100%. At such CPU usage, it's quite hard to get even raw output image without UI elements going at smooth and steady framerate as color mapping has to be recomputed on every interaction. Let alone VFB with dozens of gadgets.

GPU accelerate it then.

As for the features I described, these are essential. Period. Though, I wouldn't expect curves or levels to play along in real time while the output is being produced. But still, with GPUs today sitting idle while CPU rendering, anything's possible.

By the way, the Luxo VFB is pretty damn nice! I'm not too familiar with it, but from what I've seen, it's damn close to what I'd consider a great VFB.

2013-01-19, 16:40:37
Reply #32

Ludvik Koutny

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Yes, Luxology VFB is indeed nice, but also very slow. That's the point. I too would be happy for feature rich VFB, but i do not think GPU acceleration is something easy, and CPU version will never be fast with large feature set.

2013-01-19, 18:12:26
Reply #33

maru

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I believe what Loocas said here is most important.

The poll in this thread is completely pointless. Probably should be removed.

For me, an ideal VFB should consist of:
-small, clear buttons with minimalistic, legible icons (good example: the immortal "floppy disk" icon for "save" function)
-lots of space for the rendering output, little place for menu and icons
-short tooltips on mouseover
-probably black and white icons on square buttons

You should never use huge icons with fancy drawings + text.

For me Vray's and Brazil's VFBs are close to ideal.

2013-01-19, 18:30:19
Reply #34

lacilaci

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how about no visible menu at all. Only with rightclick to main menu(with possibility of quick gesture movements) and for some features a popup window...?

2013-01-19, 19:04:10
Reply #35

maru

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I don't think it would work with stuffed up CPU. Doesn't seem practical anyway.

I think it would be cool to have interface that is constructed like menus you meet on modern mobile devices, for example:

By default, you only see icons that are generally useful (this would need some research) and somewhere there is a separate button for "advanced" options that users need to have only in certain situations. After pressing this "advanced" button, you get another row(s) of buttons for advanced actions.

I'm not a UI designer and all of this probably sounds obvious but this is how I feel a modern, clear interface should work. I sometimes encounter interfaces that are so horrible (for example symbian devices, CMSs, ribbon, older corel software, adobe flash) and I really wouldn't like Corona to end up like one of them.

2013-01-19, 19:05:05
Reply #36

loocas

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Yes, Luxology VFB is indeed nice, but also very slow. That's the point. I too would be happy for feature rich VFB, but i do not think GPU acceleration is something easy, and CPU version will never be fast with large feature set.

Agreed. But then, if you can't do it properly, why do it at all?

There are more important features to figure out, than a half-assed VFB that nobody will be satisfied with.

As for speed, Cebas' VFB (still in alpha, so, keep this info to yourselves :) ) is pretty damn fast and it features histogram, waveform for review and levels and curves for manipulation as well as some simple compositing tools ala Photoshop (layered stack) for quick comp checkups and PSD export. All works in real-time WHILE rendering.

If they can get it out fast and good as they did with the EXR import/export plugin, Autodesk will buy it, again, and all your work here will be for nothing as you'll be "forced" to adapt Corona for their own VFB.

AFAIK, that's their plan anyways.


So a custom VFB for Corona would be pretty damn low on "my" ToDo list, to be honest.

2013-01-19, 19:12:31
Reply #37

loocas

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I sometimes encounter interfaces that are so horrible (for example ... ribbon...)

I don't like Ribbon as much as anyone using AutoCAD or Max here, but, I have to say something. Microsoft put a TON of effort into Ribbon and actually made it work pretty damn well in Office, which was the sole point of Ribbon.

Ribbon is an Office designed UI that works in Office, but companies like Autodesk saw how flashy, sexy, hip and in this looks so they adapted it, mindlessly, in their applications, such as AutoCAD and Max, for no benefit to the users. I can do stuff that Ribbon provides much faster and with much less effort without the Ribbon than with it. The only real reason Ribbon is in Max is because it looks cool on the promo images and demo videos.

That being said, if Ribbon worked for the VFB well (which it wouldn't as it was primarily designed to get rid of super-deep nested/cascaded sub-menus that plagued Office), I'd be all for it.

The problem here I see is that this feature should not be democratically decided :)

Keymaster, or whoever responsible for the VFB, should gather as much data and input information from the actual users as they could and then and ONLY THEN should they hire a professional UX/UI designer that'd come up with a universal, fast and sleek GUI that'd be productive and useful.

I know myself what a UI/UX designer can bring to the table, when supplied with enough information and how important that is to the product and the end users in the end.

Again, Microsoft's thorough GUI research lead them to develop and design Ribbon for Office, which DOES WORK.
Autodesk's greed led them to implement Ribbon in Max, which DOES NOT WORK.
« Last Edit: 2013-01-19, 19:14:02 by loocas »

2013-01-19, 19:41:27
Reply #38

maru

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You are probably right, I don't have much experience with MS Office. Launching ribbon elements in Max, like Graphite modelling tools, on a low-end pc causes a MASSIVE system freeze, it's really painful. But I doubt Keymaster will try implementing ribbon so let's hear about others' visions of Corona vfb.